CWWK/Topton/... Nxxx quad NIC router

[moonman]

Does anyone know how significant the thermal performance is between the variation b and variation c cases are?

Probably not significant enough for N100 cpu, but if you buy with a higher TDP cpu then it may be a bigger problem/difference.

 

[GreenTechzone]

I have ordered the KingnovyPC 8505 version with 4x 2.5G will post here once I receive it.. My reason for chossing 8505 over the N100/N300 is that I need m.2 with x4 PCIe lanes ... the 8505 has 20 PCIe lanes vs. the 9 PCIe lanes of the N100/N300

 

[casperghst42]

Thank you for testing the new N100 device and for the BIOS screenshots. Unfortunately the BIOS of this N100 mainboard seems to lack support for "Serial Port Console Redirection" despite the fact that it has a COM header (serial port).

I had extended discussion with CWWK support and asked if "Serial Port Console Redirection" could be added to the Jasper Lake N5105/N6005 V4+V5 mainboards, which are the predecessors of this N100 board. CWWK were open to this suggestion but in the end I was told that the manufacturer of the mainboards refused too enable this feature. All devices that have a COM port in the front panel seem to have it but the devices that only have a COM header do not

"Serial Port Console Redirection" would allow to monitor the entire boot process and BIOS access via serial connection (cable or bluetooth) as shown below:


View attachment 28369

Which exactly board is this one - I am also intersted in the console redirection ?

 

[andnet81]

The awesome people at HUNSN were kind enough to send me a fan kit.

Here we go...
View attachment 30794
There's a recess for the fan plug, never noticed that. Really good quality those things...
View attachment 30795



Fixing the fan


View attachment 30801

Went with auto mode for now. And I can only hear the fan if I put my ear next to the bottom of the device...

Has anyone found a way to read the fan speed in Debian? I was unsuccessful finding the sensor so far...

Hi, the extremely friendly and helpfull support staff from HUNSN sent me a fan kit as well (2 weeks delivery from China).
I asked them about the cable and adapter, which was somewhat hard to source otherwise.
The cabling is a bit janky, the port gets squeezed a lot when the side cover is reattached. The milled out part in the cover only helps a little.
The fan is not really quiet, and the bearings sound not trustworthy at all - when I find a better quality fan, I will replace it.
Regardless - it was free, so I am not complaining!

I did not have any luck reading the sensors from Debian (well, Proxmox) either, or with other distributions I loaded via USB.
Is that really important? Are you worried about not spotting fan failures?
I have an alarm set for temperature, at least that's covered easily.

 

[xternal]

So i fixed my CPU issue. If anyone else has problems, I think it was some rouge tuneables or junk in my config. I have been migrating my backup from a long while back across different hardware.
I did a fresh in stall and just imported a couple of specific settings and now it is working correctly

 

[minimos]

info about PL1 and PL2:


More on GitHub - horshack-dpreview/setPL: Set PL1 and PL2 power limits for modern Intel processors running on Linux

You can either set the limits in the BIOS, or by running the following commands under linux (e.g. proxmoax):

> powercap-info -p intel-rapl

enabled: 1
Zone 0
name: package-0
enabled: 1
max_energy_range_uj: 262143328850
energy_uj: 53023267885
Constraint 0
name: long_term
power_limit_uw: 6000000
time_window_us: 27983872
max_power_uw: 6000000
Constraint 1
name: short_term
power_limit_uw: 26000000
time_window_us: 2440
max_power_uw: 0
Constraint 2
name: peak_power
power_limit_uw: 78000000
time_window_us: 0
max_power_uw: 0

-> here the PL limits are 6W and 26W


to set the limits (here 25W peak and 6W normal), use

> powercap-set -z 0 -p intel-rapl -c 1 -l 25000000
> powercap-set -z 0 -p intel-rapl -c 0 -l 6000000

Then you can use the typical programs (stress-ng etc.) and sensors to monitor power consumption, CPU speed and heat, and choose whatever suits you. I am using 20W/6W at the moment and haven't run into any situation this wasn't fast enough or caused the CPU to overheat.

Thank you. I will have a play with my settings. Looking for the most speed with least heat to keep the device running for years if possible.

I'm also thinking about repasting the compound. I'd be grateful if you could provide some sort of guide on how to do this?

I guess its along the lines of remove the cover, reamove the backplate, unscrew the MB?

What I am uncertain on is how the heatsink attaches to the cpu/case? Do I need to take care with this, any tips you have from performing the procedure yourself

 

[alexw1982]

So, I finally also got my N100 4-port (Hunsn RJ35) box. Ran a couple of tests.

CPU temp is fine - idling at 29-32°C in proxmox with opnsense & ubuntu vm (no real NIC activity though) and tops out around 60°C when under persistent full load (stress-ng matrix for multiple hours resulted in max temp of 61°C).
However running memtest86+ on the 32GB Crucial CT32G48C40S5 RAM results in overheating of the RAM itself (>90°C) and consequently errors in the memtest. I ordered a second unit to check if it is an issue with the RAM (but I dont think so).

Since CPU temps are fine, I wonder if repasting would help at all or if I need a RAM heatspreader and/or fan in the case. Pointing a household fan at the case reduced temps enough to have the memory not produce any errors anymore. Generally, I assume in my everyday use cases the RAM would become that hot anyhow but I would rather have a cooler RAM that lasts longer

Insights / help would be much appreciated

FYI: I added a RAM heatsink that reduced the temperatures just enough to not have memtest86+ fry the memory chips enough to avoid errors (tops out below <90°C / reduced max temp by aroound 10-15°C) - will also add the fan kit provided from HUNSN. I've also repasted the CPU with MX-6 thermal compound but got only a minor reduction in max temp (tops out around 58°C). But internal fan for SSDs and Ram plus my poor mans approach to the external fan should make for a cool system ... I thought about repasting again with a little more compound but I am not sure that would help ...

 

[devast]

I got the cheapest "topton" variant. It is what it is, cheap. The cooling is really bad, the case heats up with load to temperatures that can burn your skin. Since the case that acts as a cooler has so high temperature, its impossible to cool down the internal components: the ddr5 module and the nvme ssd. They are basically enclosed in a ~60-65 celsius oven. The bios is also quite bad. A lot of things are missing that are available in changwang (cwwk) variants. The only positive things about it are: it's cheap, and there is console port redirect available (testing is pending until i get my console cable).
Box is named G30W-N100, has N100, 4x i226, 1x rj45 console, 1x2280, 1x 3052? m2 and one more whatever slot.
It also has slots for sim cards, though it's funny who thought lte/5g modem would work with insane power and heat output inside the case lol. The board manufacturer probably never intended to sell this as "passive" inside that enclosure, as there's smart fan control exposed in bios and theres a 4pin header too.
Though it does not have any hdmi bugs, at least i had no problem with hdmi. Bios date 31/07/2023
I'll link a high res image of it: https://i.ibb.co/XXsNp53/PXL-20230904-082449566.jpg

 

[bhigh]

Has anyone tried the N305 with a 48 GB SO-DIMM? My barebone model arrived today and I'm hoping to max out the memory.

 

[moonman]

Has anyone tried to enable Receive Side Scaling (RSS) for i226 controller? Intel says i226 supports RSS, however following the tutorial at [Tutorial/Call for Testing] Enabling Receive Side Scaling on OPNsense (same as the wiki) I get nothing for vectors

dmesg | grep vectors

i226 uses igc driver, but I assume it's the same as igb and it doesn't expose a tunable, and RSS is always enabled, however it is unknown (at least I couldn't find any info) whether igc supports RSS at all since i225 hardware apparantly does not.

 

[korax]

FYI: I added a RAM heatsink that reduced the temperatures just enough to not have memtest86+ fry the memory chips enough to avoid errors (tops out below <90°C / reduced max temp by aroound 10-15°C) - will also add the fan kit provided from HUNSN. I've also repasted the CPU with MX-6 thermal compound but got only a minor reduction in max temp (tops out around 58°C). But internal fan for SSDs and Ram plus my poor mans approach to the external fan should make for a cool system ... I thought about repasting again with a little more compound but I am not sure that would help ...

I have a heatsink on my SSD which means there is not enough room to fit the internal fan now. Seeing it is only connected x1 pcie I probably shouldn't have put it on.
So ended up ordering a 12cm external USB powered fan and see if that keeps it cooler. The case certainly gets VERY hot at the moment when I do a memtest
That RAM heatsink sounds like a good idea and looks like it shouldn't get in the way of an internal fan

 

[alexw1982]

I have a heatsink on my SSD which means there is not enough room to fit the internal fan now. Seeing it is only connected x1 pcie I probably shouldn't have put it on.
So ended up ordering a 12cm external USB powered fan and see if that keeps it cooler. The case certainly gets VERY hot at the moment when I do a memtest
That RAM heatsink sounds like a good idea and looks like it shouldn't get in the way of an internal fan

Which case do you have. I would assume that a 80x10mm fan and a low height ssd cooler should fit in there at the same time if you have the model C … will try in a couple of weeks and report back

 

[cheesyandy]

I have the HUNSN N100 device ordered from amazon:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0BZJDNB4P?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details&th=1

Bought barebone and added 32GB crucial RAM and 2TB Crucial P3 SSD.

Like several others in this thread I have been running into overheating issues, the case does a great job of keeping the CPU cool and memtest86 runs ok. I'm assuming that problem I have is with the SDD overheating and causing the system to die, although it haven't been able to conclusively prove this. By the way if you are looking for a good stress test for SSD's I would recommend performing the initial block sync for a bitcoin node. A few hours of that on a hot day seemed to kill the system pretty reliably unless I directed an external fan at the underside of the case. I have tried a heatsink on the SSD which seemed to help a bit but din't fix the problem.

The way that the memory and SSD are mounted underneath the board seems like a design flaw to me as the heat is just trapped. I suspect that it is a design flaw that HUNSN are well aware of hence their apparent eagerness to send out free fan kits to anyone that is having overheating issues. Mine is on its way.

I was reluctant to add a fan since my main reason for buying this device was that it was fanless, but I'm hoping that I'll be able to set the fan speed very low, hopefully just having that little bit of airflow over the SSD will make all the difference. I will update when the fan arrives. By the way HUNSN support assure me that the issues with the BIOS fan control reported earlier in this thread do not apply to this particular model. It would be nice if the fan speed could be tied to the SSD temp, but I'm guessing I will have to link to the CPU temp and hope for the best.

 

[AnthonyUK]

Has anyone tried the N305 with a 48 GB SO-DIMM? My barebone model arrived today and I'm hoping to max out the memory.

You do know it only officially supports 16Gb ram? It may work (people have had success with 32Gb at least) but if you need that much maybe it wasn’t the best choice for you.

 

[alexw1982]

You do know it only officially supports 16Gb ram? It may work (people have had success with 32Gb at least) but if you need that much maybe it wasn’t the best choice for you.

you could give the CT48G56C46S5 Ram a try. The 32GB module works without issues in at least two units. But order somewhere where there is free returns available as it is 3x the official maximum

 

[fta]

Has anyone tried to enable Receive Side Scaling (RSS) for i226 controller?

Here is my experience with it:

https://forums.servethehome.com/index.php?threads/cwwk-i5-1235u-6-port-i226-report.39341/post-381357

 

[bhigh]

You do know it only officially supports 16Gb ram? It may work (people have had success with 32Gb at least) but if you need that much maybe it wasn’t the best choice for you.

I'm aware, but I also know that it works just fine with 32GB dual-rank SO-DIMMs. I also know that the N100 works fine with 12GB, because I have a mini N100 computer with 12GB.

you could give the CT48G56C46S5 Ram a try. The 32GB module works without issues in at least two units. But order somewhere where there is free returns available as it is 3x the official maximum

I ended up ordering the CT32G48C40S5 from Amazon since there are others reporting success with the same SKU.

 

[alexw1982]

Wrap up...

- Initial hardware preparation was to replace the original thermal paste with Arctic MX4.
- Installation of opnsense bare metal failed due to issues with the hard drive. FreeBSD constantly caused errors. Opnsense on Proxmox runs stable.


BIOS:
- All unneeded hardware off and unplugged: SATA disabled, USB HSII on xHCI disabled, HD audio disabled, Serial I2C5 controller disabled, eMMC 5.1 Controller disabled, Sensor Hub type None
- PECI on (no idea if it has an influence, it just runs)
- Platform PL1&2 disabled (no time yet to play with)
- power limit 4 override disabled
- Package PL1 = 8000, PL2 = 25000, Energy eff-turbo enabled (-> is in the CPU/Turbo sub tab)
- C-States enabled, Package limit C10

Chipset -> PCH-IO Config -> PCI Express Config:
- every unneeded PCIe slot disabled. I am using slot #1, 7,9,10 and 12. Slot 9,10,11 and 12 are the NICs. On the enabled ones, I have ASPM = auto, but L1 low and L1 Substates disabled - had no time to test the influence on Proxmox and Opnsense.



Proxmox:
The installation of Proxmox 7.4 will halt with an x-server error. Identify the VGA port with lspci ( 02:00.0 for me), then create /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/n100.conf

Section "Device"
    Identifier "Card0"
    Driver "fbdev"
    BusID "pci0:02:0:0:"
EndSection

and then run xinit again.

- CPU governor: powersave
- install PVE-Kernel 6.2, it results in a lower power consumption


Opnsense VM settings in Proxmox
- 4 CPUs, type host, all meltdown etc. mitigations disabled
- hard drive: type lvm
- NICs: both NICs: pass through and not virtual. NIC1 = WAN, NIC2 = LAN
- a third NIC of the box is connected internally to the switch and set to 100 mbit only. It is only used to access the Proxmox host. Important if you run the other NICs on pass through, as you can't share the LAN port with the Proxmox host.



Opnsense tunings:
Tunables:
dev.igc.0.fc =0, dev.igc.1.fc = 0 (Flow control disabled)
hw.acpi.cpu.cx_lowest = C3 (can be set to C8, didn't see any differences in power consumption)
hw.ibrs_disable = 1 disable Spectre V2 mitigation
hw.igc.rx_process_limit = -1 (set unlimited packets per interrupt)
hw.igc.eee_setting = 0 - Enable Energy Efficient Ethernet
vm.pmap.pti = 0 (Meltdown mitigation off)

- Interfaces -> settings: all hardware offloads enabled.
- CPU governor: Hiadaptive, Powerd disabled (had no influence)

Add an additional line in /etc/rc.conf

 harvest_mask="351"

This excludes IRQ and NICs from being uses as source for random seeds and adds some speed


Stress tests etc.:
- install lm_sensors on proxmox, run "watch sensors" in one shell
- install stress-ng and run "stress-ng --matrix 0 -t 1m" ina second shell to see, how hot the box gets after running for 1 minute.

Package limits can be read out with

powercap-info -p intel-rapl

To set PL1 = 8W and PL2 to 26 W, run:

powercap-set -z 0 -p intel-rapl -c 1 -l 26000000
powercap-set -z 0 -p intel-rapl -c 0 -l 8000000

Then run a stress test to see how well the box behaves under load.

With the above settings, my N100 draws between 6 and 12 W (measured on the 12V line, so you might have to add 15-20% if you measure at the wall, depending on the power supply details). I know that some boxes crash after running for a week, but I still consider the system to be stable. I have tried both, from long time idle (to trigger unwanted energy saving mechanisms) to 200 mbit in both directions with many connections at the same time. System is stable, no crash or reboot so far.

@Becks0815 would you say that your settings are still valid / the ones you recommend or did you notice any issues / made changes to the config?

 

[moonman]

Has anyone tried to enable Receive Side Scaling (RSS) for i226 controller? Intel says i226 supports RSS, however following the tutorial at [Tutorial/Call for Testing] Enabling Receive Side Scaling on OPNsense (same as the wiki) I get nothing for vectors

dmesg | grep vectors

i226 uses igc driver, but I assume it's the same as igb and it doesn't expose a tunable, and RSS is always enabled, however it is unknown (at least I couldn't find any info) whether igc supports RSS at all since i225 hardware apparantly does not.

Replying to my own question: icg does support RSS. dmesg | grep vectors does show output after boot up (but gets buried behind a bunch of shaper messages). Following the guide here got it working for me Performance — OPNsense documentation

 

[Becks0815]

Here is my experience with it:

https://forums.servethehome.com/index.php?threads/cwwk-i5-1235u-6-port-i226-report.39341/post-381357

I will try that one for sure.