CWWK/Topton/... Nxxx quad NIC router

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Spossis83

New Member
Apr 24, 2023
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Are there any BIOS settings to reduce the temps on the N100/200/305's? My 305 is running like a furnace(44c at 1-2% load) in the CWWK case Variation C. Is there a way to cut down on the heat, since it seems to be turboed even at idle network.

**edit** set PowerD to adaptive in pfsense and temps are now 37c idle. but still wondering if i can get lower.
 
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Becks0815

Well-Known Member
Oct 15, 2022
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Are there any BIOS settings to reduce the temps on the N100/200/305's? My 305 is running like a furnace(44c at 1-2% load) in the CWWK case Variation C. Is there a way to cut down on the heat, since it seems to be turboed even at idle network.
1) Replace the thermal paste, double check for CPU/case gaps, close them with shims or similar.
2) Use my list of changes as starting point to reduce the power consumption, including the tunables.
 
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RevAngel

Member
May 21, 2023
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Thank you @AnthonyUK . Yes, my openwrt with adblock (basically) runs on a NanoPi R4S (RK3399). And it runs at 1% per CPU with 38 degrees Celsius (at 20 ambient air temp) only. I gained 3 to 6 ms ping/packet latency with the component, but that is fine.

And I have the NanoPi R6S (RK3588S) sitting here, waiting for a "secure enough" kernel to be used as a firewall. Right now I am not using it, but I tested a ubuntu setup and it runs astonishingly well there. BUT, ARM builds are very different to x86 when it comes to software availability, a mainline kernel and hardware accelleration for 3D and video in day-to-day use-applications.

That is why I wanted to try a x86 build. I was eying the udoo x86 systems, but they are either not with a wanted CPU structure or in a price range I want to afford "just for my interests" in the differences and testing these systems. The N100/N200 changed that.

By the way, I guess the lower performance of the N200 to the N100 depends on the used PL settings for the whole package (CPU & GPU). Considering that with the same power settings used on both, I would guess that the 32 EU's of the N200 instead of the 24 EU's of the N100 would use up more power (for the 8 additional EU's of the GPU) that normally would go to the CPU.

@Becks0815 You are right, 9th page, we really need a wiki ;-) I really appreciate your input here and hope to put them into use when my system arrives.

@Spossis83 If only the CPU temp is your issue: check for thermal gaps between CPU and cooler, if there is one, fill it with a working solution. A very small gap with thermal paste, a bigger gap with thermal putty or a pad. And you can loose some CPU power, try a lower PL1 and PL2 setting. Maybe try PL1 5W and PL2 10W, if you want to go really low.
 
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RevAngel

Member
May 21, 2023
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Hey, new user here, still waiting for my fibre connection and therefore didn't buy a router yet. However I just read this announcement: The new Chuwi LarkBox X is a $199 mini PC with Intel N100, 12GB RAM and a 512GB SSD - Liliputing

This sounds like a good deal and might be easier with guarantee claims and so on? Yes, it only has two nics, but apart from that it could be a better solution than the CWWK or Topton devices, right?
Active cooling... You have to decide if you want to deal with the hassle to clean your firewall from time to time. And you probably will hear it, if it is close enough to you. But the price point is nice!
 

Peacecamper

New Member
May 23, 2023
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Active cooling... You have to decide if you want to deal with the hassle to clean your firewall from time to time. And you probably will hear it, if it is close enough to you. But the price point is nice!
I will have it in a network cabinet, so that's no issue for me. Hopefully it will be released in Europe, I'd rather order from Amazon than from Aliexpress. And let's hope these are Intel nics.
 

RevAngel

Member
May 21, 2023
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I will have it in a network cabinet, so that's no issue for me. Hopefully it will be released in Europe, I'd rather order from Amazon than from Aliexpress. And let's hope these are Intel nics.
OK, in that case, no f's are given about noise ;-)

I found a N100 for 150€ as barebone, passive, 2 Realtec 8111 (1Gb/s) NIC's here on aliexpress. Uses DDR4.
 
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AnthonyUK

Member
May 9, 2023
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A question for Nxx owners.

These boxes do not appear to require the updated microcode or kernel on Proxmox to function correctly like the N5xx and N6xx boxes.
Anyone else seeing this?
 

Loaky

New Member
May 10, 2023
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I received my N100 box yesterday. I ordered the box directly from cwwk.net

Shipping to germany took 10 days - without any extra fees or taxes. They send me a variation B model
cwwk-box.jpg

I Replaced the thermal paste according to Becks0815 hint. OEM paste was just a big blob - way too much paste was used. But under the heatsink was nearly no paste used
oem-paste.jpgoem-paste2.jpg
It looks like even cwwk sends out different units. Some of them lack in build-quality.

After some bios power tweaking I installed OpnSense bare metal. Its working perfecly fine so far.
 
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Becks0815

Well-Known Member
Oct 15, 2022
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If you need better heat transfer I am sure it could be achieved by grinding away the black surface coating where the copper element has contact with the outer case, because the black stuff isn't flat at all. But at least I don't do this, the temps are already fine.
 

miro123

New Member
Apr 25, 2023
17
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In term of thermal there is not much to win with optimizing contact betweeen copper plate and aluminum @25W /dT= 5..50mK
The hotsport remaning die->CPU package-> copper plate contact area.
Further imporovement are possible only if you have access professinal metal processing equipment - mount heatpipes. In general their thermal conductivity is amount 10..100 times better that pure copper. at the same dimensions.
The most viewable way for home/hobby users is directly to buy case with heatpipes.
I attached the crop of my setup - The aluminium sheet has many purposes
1. EMC -shiled - connected to PE
2. fire protectio
3. mechanical - all telecom staff connected in one place
4. Thermal - AL sheet lays against the wall. 15..20wats are spread on 1m2 al sheet
5. Easy to maintain - The four case screw remains on top
 

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RevAngel

Member
May 21, 2023
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@AnthonyUK You are right, I guess that will be a common theme with cheaper and non-router-use boxes.

I received my N100 box yesterday. I ordered the box directly from cwwk.net

Shipping to germany took 10 days - without any extra fees or taxes. They send me a variation B model

After some bios power tweaking I installed OpnSense bare metal. Its working perfecly fine so far.
Yes! Thank you, that is good news for me!
 

weiyiaw85

New Member
Apr 15, 2023
23
3
3
I received my N100 box yesterday. I ordered the box directly from cwwk.net

Shipping to germany took 10 days - without any extra fees or taxes. They send me a variation B model
View attachment 29164

I Replaced the thermal paste according to Becks0815 hint. OEM paste was just a big blob - way too much paste was used. But under the heatsink was nearly no paste used
View attachment 29165View attachment 29169
It looks like even cwwk sends out different units. Some of them lack in build-quality.

After some bios power tweaking I installed OpnSense bare metal. Its working perfecly fine so far.
you order from their website ? not AliExpress?

you order is without RAM & SSD ?

im was thinking to get with or without ram & ssd ? not sure they give what brand of ram and ssd
 

RevAngel

Member
May 21, 2023
56
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After some bios power tweaking I installed OpnSense bare metal. Its working perfecly fine so far.
Can you remember and maybe tell us what bios settings you changed, for opnsense to work on bare metal? Thank you!
 

Loaky

New Member
May 10, 2023
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you order from their website ? not AliExpress?

you order is without RAM & SSD ?

im was thinking to get with or without ram & ssd ? not sure they give what brand of ram and ssd
I ordered directly from their website. No RAM & SSD included. I ordered a 32GB Crucial stick and a Samsung 980 locally. It is cheaper to order both locally than in a bundle from cwwk. On the other hand i can choose the parts I use.

Can you remember and maybe tell us what bios settings you changed, for opnsense to work on bare metal? Thank you!
I removed the pre-installed adapter board and plugged my nvme drive directly in PCIE1. For the bios settings I can't tell exactly what I've changed in detail. As the box is running in OpnSense right now, I can't check my settings.
As far as I can remember:
- PL1 and PL2 enabled
- PL1 = 12500
- PL2 = 20000
- PCIE1 ASPM Ls0 & Ls1 enabled
- C-States enabled
- disabled unnessesary hardware such as eMMC, SATA, audio,...
 
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RevAngel

Member
May 21, 2023
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Thank you very much!
I just realized how well these things must be selling. The price just went up 50€ for every CPU type on aliexpress, for the seller "Topton Computer Store".
 
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