AMD making a fool of Threadripper customers - AGAIN?

[gsrcrxsi]

People just got so excited when they see someone talked about something bad around AMD, and then all suddenly disappeared when they realized that it's actually due to misunderstanding and exaggeration.

No. Just not worth the energy to deal with someone delusional and unreasonable. it’s sad that you can’t see that your “proofs” are not proof at all but your own biased opinion. You’re guilty of exactly what you are arguing about.

Until Zen2, I exclusively used Intel, because they were better. I look at performance and features, not some nonsense fandom. I don’t really care about the AMD vs Intel wars, I only ever commented on your illogical arguments.

 

[111alan]

No. Just not worth the energy to deal with someone delusional and unreasonable. it’s sad that you can’t see that your “proofs” are not proof at all but your own biased opinion. You’re guilty of exactly what you are arguing about.

Until Zen2, I exclusively used Intel, because they were better. I look at performance and features, not some nonsense fandom. I don’t really care about the AMD vs Intel wars, I only ever commented on your illogical arguments.

You think it's illogical, but it's not lol.

Anyway, does this topic have anything to do with the performance?

 

[gsrcrxsi]

You think the only reason people choose AMD is because of fandom lol.

 

[111alan]

Most people on this forum actually use mostly Intel products, including me.

@111alan The reason people stopped responding is because this thread has gone on for 7 pages and 6.5 pages of it was pointless. Come on, your other posts and participation are pretty good. If you intend to provoke a war as you described in CH and I know happens on CH, just say it. Are you sure this is the hill you want to die on?

No, just letting people know these actually can happen, and that is all.

 

[111alan]

You think the only reason people choose AMD is because of fandom lol.

wut, I never said that, even remotely.

 

[gsrcrxsi]

No, just letting people know these actually can happen, and that is all.

“Can” and “are” are two vastly different ideas. You claim, without proof, that they ARE. That’s the problem.

now you’re back pedaling

 

[111alan]

“Can” and “are” are two vastly different ideas. You claim, without proof, that they ARE. That’s the problem.

now you’re back pedaling

Technically, I said there is evidence about the high possibility of this happening. Look at my first few posts.

And, the speech control is happening, in large forums at administration level. What's in question is that whether AMD gave them money to do it or not.

For that part you can make up your own mind. But I insist that the chances are very high, because from the method I learned from judicial systems, the forum's subjective intentions coincide with its objective deeds.

Of course, nobody can force others to accept his ideas through the RJ45 port, I respect others' interpretation of this matter. But I still have to respond to the attack directly aiming at myself.

 

[gsrcrxsi]

Honestly nothing you posted shows a “high possibility” of AMD being involved in any way. Nothing that’s makes it a higher possibility than simply fandom. It’s clear you have your own biases that make you want to vilify AMD in some way.

and you really don’t have to reply here to any supposed attacks on some random Chinese forum. I can assure no one here cares that much about any specific person’s reputation

 

[111alan]

Honestly nothing you posted shows a “high possibility” of AMD being involved in any way. Nothing that’s makes it a higher possibility than simply fandom. It’s clear you have your own biases that make you want to vilify AMD in some way.

and you really don’t have to reply here to any supposed attacks on some random Chinese forum. I can assure no one here cares that much about any specific person’s reputation

If it's only about random users in random forums it's nothing. But it's on "administration level" in the only two large forums(they are even more known in China than ANAND in USA), meaning the admins are directly supporting the personal attack and other prohibited actions, aiming at removing the speaker, and it's in a such organized pattern, I don't think it's what "fandom" can achieve. They usually value money much more than truth. If you know chinese you can actually see what's happening in those posts listed.

Of course you can have your own view, I just speak mine.

 

[ReturnedSword]

@111alan No one is attacking you. They are questioning your “proof,” which as they pointed out, are not proofs. It is entirely normal in a principled debate to question findings, and expect that findings are backed up and able to be replicated. Even if a so-called scientist or researcher is compelled to “find” evidence when challenged, it means their original theory could not hold its own weight.

Claiming AMD is paying people, even in China, is laughable. You are mistaking the zeal and indoctrination of Intel vs AMD fanboys for “paid.” I can claim Intel positive posts are paid as well, but that would also equally be ridiculous. Intel didn’t even historically pay individuals, they paid vendors, OEMs, and ODMs via “‘marketing assistance.” And as I said, that bribery is increasingly ineffective because the products don’t speak for themselves.

AMD is a company that was only worth $12 billion even during the height of the Opteron supremacy over 10 years ago. AMD was on the verge of bankruptcy before Lisa Su took over. They were even a penny stock for many years. Even now they are a much smaller company than Intel.AMD doesn’t even have control over its own fabs and production. They are not even the biggest customer of TMSC and Samsung Fab. There are many court cases where it was proven Intel engaged in monopolistic and market harming practices. Where are the court cases against AMD? Don’t you think Intel will take any chance to bring AMD down if they can?

If I can realize all this even though most of my computers are Intel (80%+), why can’t you?

Just let it go.

 

[111alan]

@111alan No one is attacking you. They are questioning your “proof,” which as they pointed out, are not proofs. It is entirely normal in a principled debate to question findings, and expect that findings are backed up and able to be replicated. Even if a so-called scientist or researcher is compelled to “find” evidence when challenged, it means their original theory could not hold its own weight.

Claiming AMD is paying people, even in China, is laughable. You are mistaking the zeal and indoctrination of Intel vs AMD fanboys for “paid.” I can claim Intel positive posts are paid as well, but that would also equally be ridiculous. Intel didn’t even historically pay individuals, they paid vendors, OEMs, and ODMs via “‘marketing assistance.” And as I said, that bribery is increasingly ineffective because the products don’t speak for themselves.

AMD is a company that was only worth $12 billion even during the height of the Opteron supremacy over 10 years ago. AMD was on the verge of bankruptcy before Lisa Su took over. They were even a penny stock for many years. Even now they are a much smaller company than Intel.AMD doesn’t even have control over its own fabs and production. They are not even the biggest customer of TMSC and Samsung Fab. There are many court cases where it was proven Intel engaged in monopolistic and market harming practices. Where are the court cases against AMD? Don’t you think Intel will take any chance to bring AMD down if they can?

If I can realize all this even though most of my computers are Intel (80%+), why can’t you?

Just let it go.

I just think the scale, organized level and privileges in the community involved is far too big for simply fandom to muster, to be short. My evidences are mostly about this.

I've seen a lot of fandom in 20+ years. I see a lot of people still despise AMD graphic cards now while being an absolute fan of Nvidia for many years. They have never done these actions, actions that's so focused on people rather than technology itself, or acquired any actual power in order to do these.

Because it has something to do with experience, I was only speaking about the end conclusion as a possibility. But I have to insist that what I listed are the facts that have already happened, not just some made-up stuff, and are not opinions.

BTW I still recommend Ansys budget users to get Ryzens now. I do not mix what's happening in the community into choices.

 

[ReturnedSword]

And I’m saying what you offered as “evidence” is in fact not evidence. Evidence is actual, valid, unbiased truth presented. Opinions are not and never evidence.

We must agree that forums are independent entities run by private individuals right? And like any other private person they may have their own biases.

It’s a bit amusing that you bring up the allegation that nVidia fanboys never attack others Jensen Huang’s fanboys are some of the worst fanboys there are existing. And you know what? Good for them if they want to support Jensen Huang so much.

I know quite well, and you may know it too that the Chinese people often have a soft spot for “underdogs.” It is a universal feeling. In my years following tech since the 1980s I have always supported the underdogs, but I also have the rationality to understand that there’s a limit to hoping the underdog will win. Once emotions are inputted into decisions and thought, one becomes brainless. That’s why although I hoped Cyrix will win, AMD will win, ATi will win, Kyro will win, 3DFX will win, in the end I bought the best product I could afford, even if it was Intel or NVidia at the time.

 

[gsrcrxsi]

If it's only about random users in random forums it's nothing. But it's on "administration level" in the only two large forums(they are even more known in China than ANAND in USA), meaning the admins are directly supporting the personal attack and other prohibited actions, aiming at removing the speaker, and it's in a such organized pattern, I don't think it's what "fandom" can achieve. They usually value money much more than truth. If you know chinese you can actually see what's happening in those posts listed.

Of course you can have your own view, I just speak mine.

who cares? admins of a forum are not some special authority. they are just random people. they only have authority if you give it to them.

if you have personal problems with someone on a forum, just post somewhere else and forget about it.

but it's not any proof that AMD is paying them to discredit you. you're not that important. you're just another random commenter just like anyone else.

I can assure you, I know china and chinese (mainland) culture very well. I have many friends and family who escaped china and honestly it's a large part of my own life to know these things. it has nothing to do with this thread however. but don't assume someone you're talking to "doesnt know about china/chinese" and try to use that as a basis to hand waive or dismiss their arguments.

 

[stanos4]

man, you answered pretty much none of the questions/remarks that people gave you in this thread, yet you think you're "the owner of the truth", that "everyone here is blindfolded donkey but you're the only airplane"... (no, except 1 relatively minor thing, you did not address/prove wrong even my points, but I don't care anymore bcs discussion with you is worthless and your graphs are at best "nice" for me, but I can go to main sth page or phoronix page or many other to gain much more...).

Any kind of bullying is despicable, even the one that you possibly experienced on your Chinese internet forum. I didn't notice anyone here being happy about you being bullied somewhere else, so please, why do you bring it here?
Your rage that originates possibly somewhere else is preventing you from reasonably seeing things. And even if you put something potentially interesting, people will eventually ignore you to large extent if you can't be reasoned with/discussed.
All this considering you're not just some internet troll enjoying wasting their and other's people time...

 

[RageBone]

First, did you have any doubt that what I said they did actually happen?
Y - Just look at those proofs again and tell me if there is anything more needed.
N - Then did Intel side did the same thing, which is spreading a lot of biased/false/misleading info which can't be replicated in any experiment, and personal-attacking everyone who disagrees? Or other things that have similar social effects?

Y - Kindly point that out please.
N - That's what I saw for now.

This is the stuff that now makes me think that you are a Troll.
Congratulations, i will not take you seriously anymore, maybe that changes with other Topics that you post on.
So i won't bother to answer your questions.
Have a good day

 

[111alan]

And I’m saying what you offered as “evidence” is in fact not evidence. Evidence is actual, valid, unbiased truth presented. Opinions are not and never evidence.

We must agree that forums are independent entities run by private individuals right? And like any other private person they may have their own biases.

It’s a bit amusing that you bring up the allegation that nVidia fanboys never attack others Jensen Huang’s fanboys are some of the worst fanboys there are existing. And you know what? Good for them if they want to support Jensen Huang so much.

I know quite well, and you may know it too that the Chinese people often have a soft spot for “underdogs.” It is a universal feeling. In my years following tech since the 1980s I have always supported the underdogs, but I also have the rationality to understand that there’s a limit to hoping the underdog will win. Once emotions are inputted into decisions and thought, one becomes brainless. That’s why although I hoped Cyrix will win, AMD will win, ATi will win, Kyro will win, 3DFX will win, in the end I bought the best product I could afford, even if it was Intel or NVidia at the time.

Speaking a

And I’m saying what you offered as “evidence” is in fact not evidence. Evidence is actual, valid, unbiased truth presented. Opinions are not and never evidence.

We must agree that forums are independent entities run by private individuals right? And like any other private person they may have their own biases.

It’s a bit amusing that you bring up the allegation that nVidia fanboys never attack others Jensen Huang’s fanboys are some of the worst fanboys there are existing. And you know what? Good for them if they want to support Jensen Huang so much.

I know quite well, and you may know it too that the Chinese people often have a soft spot for “underdogs.” It is a universal feeling. In my years following tech since the 1980s I have always supported the underdogs, but I also have the rationality to understand that there’s a limit to hoping the underdog will win. Once emotions are inputted into decisions and thought, one becomes brainless. That’s why although I hoped Cyrix will win, AMD will win, ATi will win, Kyro will win, 3DFX will win, in the end I bought the best product I could afford, even if it was Intel or NVidia at the time.

About Huang's fans, I think they're actually fans. They do attack people when debate heats up, but they do not just give you a title like, "you've sold a secondhand SSD to someone, so you must be voicing your opinion just to bamboozle others for some dirty money", from the start when you post, in which the contents are normal discussions, and try to ban you.

Plus this happens before you've made any posts that irritate them, and it happened to a lot of people. That's one of the reasons why things get suspicious.

Just because Huang's fans are actually fans, I've written several reviews about AMD cards, saying some of Firepro cards destroy Quadro at the same price, during the peak of AMD GPU that is GCN era. Never got anyone rush in and question my intentions.

We must agree that forums are independent entities run by private individuals right?

There might be some cultural differences here. Forums in China may usually be built on hobbies, but in the end, they're all about money. I worked for PCEVA years ago, and now working for a BIOS mod related forum called SMXdiy. Getting support to run the forum and defending from attacks/spams are the biggest parts for any forum there. Gradually some forum died, and some who gave up the original ideology in pursuit of money survived. They are running by people, but they usually do not voice their own opinions anymore. Life force people to make choices. That's why there are so many people accepting payment for voicing a certain opinion here.

About the evidence part, my understanding is that, first it has to be something actually happened, which I don't think you denied. Second, it has to have something to do with supporting the viewpoint, I think your doubt is mainly here. I think I've made clear that, this level of activity is far from what fandom can achieve alone, judging by other fanbase owned by even larger companies in history. Of course you can see it otherwise, but I don't think my views are biased and misleading as said by one other person.

Actually I also viewed AMD as a saver just like you during Zen1 times. Their architecture, although being a mixture of Haswell, K10 and the Feline lineup, still seems to have a future. Then came Zen2, which is basically a Zen1 with minor tweaks and larger caches, along with false claims all over the internet. I can only have that soft spot so much, before they destroyed the entire community in China and making any other opinions taboo, while framing some 20-year players and review sites in other countries of being biased. Then I have to think, if this ideology prevails, can we even have any community at all.

 

[111alan]

man, you answered pretty much none of the questions/remarks that people gave you in this thread, yet you think you're "the owner of the truth", that "everyone here is blindfolded donkey but you're the only airplane"... (no, except 1 relatively minor thing, you did not address/prove wrong even my points, but I don't care anymore bcs discussion with you is worthless and your graphs are at best "nice" for me, but I can go to main sth page or phoronix page or many other to gain much more...).

Any kind of bullying is despicable, even the one that you possibly experienced on your Chinese internet forum. I didn't notice anyone here being happy about you being bullied somewhere else, so please, why do you bring it here?
Your rage that originates possibly somewhere else is preventing you from reasonably seeing things. And even if you put something potentially interesting, people will eventually ignore you to large extent if you can't be reasoned with/discussed.
All this considering you're not just some internet troll enjoying wasting their and other's people time...

point out one question I didn't answer.

The title of this thread seems to mean that you can talk about AMD related behaviors. Then people to started to ask questions and get this thread 8 page long. In the end, I was just talking about the actual things people did, and that very possibility, to raise awareness.

It has been about two years since I ended any relation with them. I do not need to hate them because I want nothing from them. Nothing really about rage except the accusation part. It's just like when you see a puppet play, you know someone is controlling the puppets.

 

[111alan]

who cares? admins of a forum are not some special authority. they are just random people. they only have authority if you give it to them.

if you have personal problems with someone on a forum, just post somewhere else and forget about it.

but it's not any proof that AMD is paying them to discredit you. you're not that important. you're just another random commenter just like anyone else.

I can assure you, I know china and chinese (mainland) culture very well. I have many friends and family who escaped china and honestly it's a large part of my own life to know these things. it has nothing to do with this thread however. but don't assume someone you're talking to "doesnt know about china/chinese" and try to use that as a basis to hand waive or dismiss their arguments.

Yeah that's true, until every one of them start to do the same thing, and target everyone not just me.

I say people don't know about China, only when I see what they described that isn't true here, and I have something to add. People in us seems to rarely believe someone could bribe a lot of people to launch a reputation campaign, but it's happening every day in China. Sometimes even bots are involved.

 

[gsrcrxsi]

x399, trx40, WRX80 are all especially made not to support the next batch of CPUs(Zen1, Zen2-X, Zen2-WX).

But on the outside AMD fans are famously notorious, fabricating test data and bending truths with their explanation to their needs, while swarm attacking everyone who have second thoughts. There are also a lot of evidences indicating AMD paying independent reviewers and commenters for its reputation campaign. If you've read "the crowd", you should already know why they did all of this, and why some people just buy it.

these are the two comments you made in your first post to this thread that everyone called BS/nonsense.

you were asked for PROOF. and you responded with only anecdotal experiences about some people being mean to you on chinese internet, and that somehow makes them paid AMD shills LOL.

no. its not proof. and all of the posts and replies thus far have been you back pedaling or moving the goal posts to try to justify your position. nothing you've posted is in anyway proof of AMD paying people to be mean to you.

 

[ReturnedSword]

Ok so for the nVidia case, they’re really unpaid fans, but for AMD, who btw are also much smaller than nVidia just like they are much smaller than Intel, AMD supporting people are not fans but they are paid? How does this make any sense?