Minisforum MS-01

[NerdAshes]

I am posting this as a gathering of info for the popular MS-01 from Minisforum, unrelated to the PCIe Card and RAM Compatibility Thread. That thread is 70% not, PCIe Card and RAM Compatibility and growing. It's best to keep it at PCIe Card and RAM Compatibility (or maybe re-name it and delete this thread?).

Seems like we need a gathering place to talk all other non-PCIe Card and RAM Compatibility concerns. Like Ideas/Tips/Company-Rants/Sales/OS/UEFI-Settings/Racking/Power/Software/Bench-Marking/Best-Practices/Software/Tech-Support/TPU/Etc.. and *Questions.*

Update:
For orders made as early as January 2024.
"Orders have been delayed to the beginning of May due to the factory order surge and lack of supply capacity."

I'll start:
What are you using it for? How many did you buy? Does yours taste like strawberries?

MS-01 Data :

Model
MiniWorkStation MS-01

CPU Options
S1390: Intel® Core™ i9-13900H(With vPro® Enterprise Support)
S1290: Intel® Core™ i9-12900H(With vPro® Enterprise Support) (Can do 96GB RAM too)
S1245: Intel® Core™ i5-12450H

Graphics
S1390/S1290: Intel® Iris® Xe Graphics
S1245: Intel® UHD Graphics

Memory
DDR5-5200MHz Dual Channel (SODIMM slots x2, up to a total maximum of 96GB)

SSD
M.2 2280 NVMe SSD slot (Alt U.2) (PCIe 4.0 x4) x1 (U.2 is 7mm max and a 15.8TB SSD should be fine)
M.2 2280/22110 NVMe SSD slot (PCIe 3.0 x4) x1
M.2 2280/22110 NVMe SSD slot (PCIe 3.0 x2) x1

Expansion
1* PCIe 4.0 x16 slot (Half-height, single-slot, supports up to PCIe 4.0 x8 speed)

Wireless connectivity
M.2 2230 Wi-Fi support (Wi-Fi 6, BT5.2) (PCIe x1 (Good for a Corel TPU Single Core))

Ethernet
Intel 710 10Gbps SFP+ LAN ×2
Intel 226 2.5Gbps RJ45 LAN ×2 (One port is V-Pro Enterprise)

Video output
① HDMI 2.0 (4K@60Hz)
② USB 4 (8K@30Hz) x2

Power supply

DC 19V (Idle as low as 11w)

Best OS

Debian Testing (Don't argue, it just is... okay maybe Arch too)

Size

196×189×48ｍｍ (7.7"x7.5"x1.89")

Peripheral interfaces

USB3.2 Gen2 Type-A ports x2
USB3.2 Gen1 Type-A ports x2
USB2.0 Type-A ports x2
USB4 ports x2 (Alt PD)
HDMI x1
3.5mm combo jack x1

Known discount for minisforum website COUPERT10MINISFORUM used at check out will save you $10

Minisforum MS-01 <-- store
Minisforum <--- support drivers
Intel® Ethernet Controller X710 - Product Info, Docs, Support and... <-- 10Gb nic
Intel® Ethernet Controller I226 <--- 2.5Gb nic
I needed to load the RAID drivers (from minisfoum website saved to the USB) to install Windows.

 

[Fazio]

Currently using it as main router for my 8/2 fiber connection.
13900H, 32GB RAM 5200 MHz, Proxmox as host and Mikrotik CHR router VM.
I’m able to reach the service performances, full 8/2Gbps and no high CPU load.
As I used Opnsense for a couple of years, I think I’ll ditch it for CHR, I had low throughput as described here:

https://forums.servethehome.com/index.php?threads/minisforum-ms-01-opnsense-vm-wan-lan-low-performances.43291/

Possibly something not properly supported yet.

 

[NerdAshes]

8/2 fiber connection nice.

Cloud Hosted Router - I had to look it up. First time hearing of it.

I was planning to use OPNsence too. Not as a VM though. I ordered two of the i5 MS-01 to run it bare metal (HA over the two).
They should get here in 6 months lol. Was the CPU load high w/ OPNsense? I can't imagine it was struggling with the 13 i9. Did you pass the nic through to the VM without Pmox using it too?

I thought about trying Incus instead of Proxmox. GitHub - lxc/incus: Powerful system container and virtual machine manager

I did load up my i9 13 MS-01 w/ windows and found Intel's site has newer firmware that what Minisform provides for the nics. You might want to check that out?

 

[Fazio]

8/2 fiber connection nice.

Cloud Hosted Router - I had to look it up. First time hearing of it.

I was planning to use OPNsence too. Not as a VM though. I ordered two of the i5 MS-01 to run it bare metal (HA over the two).
They should get here in 6 months lol. Was the CPU load high w/ OPNsense? I can't imagine it was struggling with the 13 i9. Did you pass the nic through to the VM without Pmox using it too?

I thought about trying Incus instead of Proxmox. GitHub - lxc/incus: Powerful system container and virtual machine manager

I did load up my i9 13 MS-01 w/ windows and found Intel's site has newer firmware that what Minisform provides for the nics. You might want to check that out?

Nope, no high CPU load on opnsense! No evident bottlenecks..
Do you have a link for the NICs firmware? Thank you!

EDIT: I did a firmware update using this package Non-Volatile Memory (NVM) Update Utility for Intel® Ethernet Network Adapter 700 Series

Intel(R) Ethernet NVM Update Tool
NVMUpdate version 1.40.5.5
Copyright(C) 2013 - 2023 Intel Corporation.


WARNING: To avoid damage to your device, do not stop the update or reboot or power off the system during this update.
Inventory in progress. Please wait [***.......]


Num Description                          Ver.(hex)  DevId S:B    Status
=== ================================== ============ ===== ====== ==============
01) Intel(R) Ethernet Converged         9.32(9.20)   1572 00:002 Update       
    Network Adapter X710                                         available     
02) Intel(R) Ethernet Controller          N/A(N/A)   125C 00:087 Update not   
    I226-V                                                       available     
03) Intel(R) Ethernet Controller          N/A(N/A)   125B 00:090 Update not   
    I226-LM                                                      available     

Options: Adapter Index List (comma-separated), [A]ll, e[X]it
Enter selection: 01
Would you like to back up the NVM images? [Y]es/[N]o: Y
Update in progress. This operation may take several minutes.
[*****.....]
.....-****


Num Description                          Ver.(hex)  DevId S:B    Status
=== ================================== ============ ===== ====== ==============
01) Intel(R) Ethernet Converged         9.64(9.40)   1572 00:002 Update       
    Network Adapter X710                                         successful   
02) Intel(R) Ethernet Controller          N/A(N/A)   125C 00:087 Update not   
    I226-V                                                       available     
03) Intel(R) Ethernet Controller          N/A(N/A)   125B 00:090 Update not   
    I226-LM                                                      available     

A reboot is required to complete the update process.

Tool execution completed with the following status: All operations completed successfully.
Press any key to exit.


....

ethtool -i enp2s0f1
driver: i40e
version: 6.5.11-8-pve
firmware-version: 9.20 0x8000d8c5 0.0.0
expansion-rom-version:
bus-info: 0000:02:00.1
supports-statistics: yes
supports-test: yes
supports-eeprom-access: yes
supports-register-dump: yes
supports-priv-flags: yes


After:

ethtool -i enp2s0f0
driver: i40e
version: 6.5.11-8-pve
firmware-version: 9.40 0x8000ecd6 0.0.0
expansion-rom-version:
bus-info: 0000:02:00.0
supports-statistics: yes
supports-test: yes
supports-eeprom-access: yes
supports-register-dump: yes
supports-priv-flags: yes

 

[FreakyBigFoot]

I'm currently running unraid on mine. It's getting pretty hot. I'm wondering if anyone has some recommendations on what to change to help cool this bad boy down. I'm tempted to look at the thermal paste.

I also don't know what these are and I'm kind of worried. Maybe it's reading wrong, this is in unraid, but that's HOT. What is that?

 

[DaveLTX]

I'm currently running unraid on mine. It's getting pretty hot. I'm wondering if anyone has some recommendations on what to change to help cool this bad boy down. I'm tempted to look at the thermal paste.

I also don't know what these are and I'm kind of worried. Maybe it's reading wrong, this is in unraid, but that's HOT. What is that?

CPU temp? how is 55C hot?
If you're talking about the 100+ ones look at any sensor readings off any other PC you'll find its perfectly normal. We don't even know what those numbers are for but they certainly never are right

 

[heromode]

I'm currently running unraid on mine. It's getting pretty hot. I'm wondering if anyone has some recommendations on what to change to help cool this bad boy down. I'm tempted to look at the thermal paste.

I also don't know what these are and I'm kind of worried. Maybe it's reading wrong, this is in unraid, but that's HOT. What is that?

The SYSTIN and AUXTIN readings? Those are normal, nothing to worry about. I don't see a problem with those any of your temps.

 

[FreakyBigFoot]

CPU temp? how is 55C hot?
If you're talking about the 100+ ones look at any sensor readings off any other PC you'll find its perfectly normal. We don't even know what those numbers are for but they certainly never are right

I was referring to the 115C

 

[Earru]

I was referring to the 115C

Did you solve this temp issue?

 

[DaveLTX]

Did you solve this temp issue?

There is no issue

 

[markconstable]

I want to use mine as a virtual desktop with Proxmox and CachyOS (Arch based) as my primary daily driver *IF* I can get iGPU passthrough to work to the Xe gpu. Has anyone with a MS-01 tried iGU passthrough yet?

 

[NerdAshes]

I want to use mine as a virtual desktop with Proxmox and CachyOS (Arch based) as my primary daily driver *IF* I can get iGPU passthrough to work to the Xe gpu. Has anyone with a MS-01 tried iGU passthrough yet?

Why not just connected it directly to your monitor and skip the virtual desktop? I'm not saying you should not do it the way you mentioned, just wondering why you'd want the extra complexity.

I've read something about success with the pass-through in the PCIe cards thread. I'm not sure how it was done, but it seemed a walk-through was followed on another site.

 

[ms264556]

Why not just connected it directly to your monitor and skip the virtual desktop? I'm not saying you should not do it the way you mentioned, just wondering why you'd want the extra complexity.

I've read something about success with the pass-through in the PCIe cards thread. I'm not sure how it was done, but it seemed a walk-through was followed on another site.

I haven't seen any walkthroughs which successfully got the iGPU passed through including video output. Even PCIe GPU passthrough was a pain with significant limitations. Another user here said they'd done it for Linux guests but I had no luck trying it last week.

I wanted Windows as my main desktop, with proxmox for testing/staging. After one too many proxmox GPU passthrough problems requiring workarounds, I instead used Windows as the host, installing proxmox inside Hyper-V for testing/staging.

If Arch was my preferred daily driver, but I wanted to experiment with proxmox, then I'd install KVM and virt manager (since this seems to be the standard hypervisor solution), enable nested virtualization & install a proxmox vm.

 

[NerdAshes]

I haven't seen any walkthroughs which successfully got the iGPU passed through including video output. Even PCIe GPU passthrough was a pain with significant limitations. Another user here said they'd done it for Linux guests but I had no luck trying it last week.

I wonder if using a USB C port as the video out, instead of HDMI, would fix the issue? Since USB pass-through is normally easy enough?

I wanted Windows as my main desktop, with proxmox for testing/staging. After one too many proxmox GPU passthrough problems requiring workarounds, I instead used Windows as the host, installing proxmox inside Hyper-V for testing/staging.

If you want Windows as the main OS - Hyper-V is an awesome solution. I always thought it was simple and surprisingly powerful.

If Arch was my preferred daily driver, but I wanted to experiment with proxmox, then I'd install KVM and virt manager (since this seems to be the standard hypervisor solution), enable nested virtualization & install a proxmox vm.

With Arch you could try the Proxmox alternative "Incus". Looks cool haven't tried it though. Incus

 

[markconstable]

Incus has a lot of promise but for now Proxmox has a better integrated web ui and an excellent backup system (Proxmox Backup Server). In my case, the reason I want to run a linux desktop in a VM with iGPU passthrough, is to take advantage of that excellent backup system and being able to restore my entire desktop system anytime for any reason... clone it, snapshot it when testing updates, move it around the cluster, all the regular things you can do with a server but as my daily desktop driver. Sure, I could remote in via RDP/whatever but that is just not good enough for all-day use. The other point is I want to use a small ~32GB core OS + home dir VM and push all data to integrated CephFS storage (each PVE cluster node has at least one OSD) and the 10Gb nics on the MS-01 have me salivating at this prospect.

ATM, while waiting for a pair of MS-01s to show up (hopefully before the end of this year!) I am runng the plasma-desktop package + friends on each of my Terramaster NAS PVE nodes. It's working out surprisingly well, albeit slow on an older Plasma 5.27.5, but the quad core N5095 with UHD gfx even drives a 4K monitor (but only just). CachyOS with Plasma 6 in a VM with GPU passthrough should be absolutely delightful... if I can get passthrough to work.

 

[NerdAshes]

I was just informed by the Minisforum Team via support email, that orders made in January 2024 "have been delayed to the beginning of May due to the factory order surge and lack of supply capacity". There was no update for orders I made after January, insinuating that it'll be much longer to ship them.The communication I have received from Minisforum (none, besides a reply to my direct inquiry, for status on my orders) continues to be substandard. You have to have to reach out for status updates and even then, they may not be accurate. I would expect backorders and communication to get worse. I just don't think Minisforum was ready for the interest/orders the MS-01 would bring.

They are currently looking at a 4+ month backorder list.

If you have a MS-01 and need a warranty replacement - I doubt they have the ability to serve your needs (at least in a timely fashion) . I would consider the factory warranty as useless, until things stabilize at Minisforum. You may want to look at other options, if support and warranty are important to you ;-)

 

[Deepcuts]

Anyone using MS-01 with Proxmox and Mikrotik CHR and managed to get the Intel X710 in passthrough mode working?
I mean it is working, but when starting up the VM I have to unplug/plug back the DAC or disable/enable the interface on the switch or else no traffic or link.
If I change anything on the interface from WinBox, again the same issue.

 

[anewsome]

I ordered 5 with i9-13900H processor, barebones. Placed the order on Jan 21 and received all 5 in early April. Plan is to proxmox cluster them all, replacing a rack of aging, space consuming, power hungry, loud, hot Xeon servers. I've only got one node installed, waiting on RAM, NVMEs, 10g & 2.5G switches and various parts to finish building the cluster.

Already figured out vPro AMT remote & KVM access - even got the Serial Over Lan (SOL) console working with Proxmox too.

My plan for RAM and NVME is 96GB ram on all, 3x 2TB NVME SSD on all. Going to give Ceph a try to aggregate all the disks (using 10gbe network), if it's too slow, then I'll be using the NVME as local storage for the Proxmox host.

 

[NerdAshes]

I ordered 5 with i9-13900H processor, barebones. Placed the order on Jan 21 and received all 5 in early April. Plan is to proxmox cluster them all, replacing a rack of aging, space consuming, power hungry, loud, hot Xeon servers. I've only got one node installed, waiting on RAM, NVMEs, 10g & 2.5G switches and various parts to finish building the cluster.

Already figured out vPro AMT remote & KVM access - even got the Serial Over Lan (SOL) console working with Proxmox too.

My plan for RAM and NVME is 96GB ram on all, 3x 2TB NVME SSD on all. Going to give Ceph a try to aggregate all the disks (using 10gbe network), if it's too slow, then I'll be using the NVME as local storage for the Proxmox host.

I have 3 of those setup in similar fashion. Ceph should work okay over 10gbps - since it's going to running at the speed of the slowest drive (unless you set it up different) PCIe 3 x2. You might want to aggregate two of the 10gb ports however. 985 MB/s x 2 lanes = 1970 MB/s x 3 Drives = 5910 MB/s = 47.29 Gigabits per second... minus some over head, and a little fairy magic = you should have 40 Gb/s NICs and Switches (50 to be safe).

With 12 cloud image Debian VMs and 30ish LXC's I'm currently using ~ 1% of my 3 node cluster's CPU/Storage and 7% of it's RAM.. I'd like to know what you're going to do with 5! I'm not judging - I almost bought 5, until I got the bills for the three 7.8TB U.2 NVMEs, three sets of 96GB RAM, six 4TB 2280 NVMEs, three 100Gb dual port Connectx-5 NICs, three 240w power bricks and three 140mm USB case fans.. only then did I decide three i9-13900H was enough. That and the "cheap" $680 100Gb switches only have 4 ports... so 3 MS-01 it is!

My last two MS-01 are the i5s. They will be for networking (not hypervisors with VMs - but baremetal). I ordered them on the 27th of January and was told in an email they would ship no later than April 1st - they did not. Now I'm told "the begging of May". /sigh
I can buy the i9-13s w/ 1TB SSD and 32 GB RAM and get them in two days. Right now it looks like I could buy 10 of them. If I could justify the $440 in price difference (each) - I'd just get them and be done with it.

 

[HansBKK]

What is the max length of half-height PCIe card this will take?

Has anyone actually tested the 96GB RAM (48x2 sticks) works properly, and using what software, how many hours / passes?

Does the motherboard support PCIe Bifurcation?

either x8 into x4/x4, or x16 into x4/x4/x4/x4 ?

What size standard does it match?

Can it be re-mounted into a NAS case with hot-swap drawers? All suggestions welcome, at least 6 slots...