Intel P4510 vs P4610

[d1ck13]

Hi everyone,

I’m planning to replace the two Samsung 970 Evo Plus Cache NVMe drives in my Unraid server with two Intel U.2 NVMe drives.

I have the choice between the Intel P4510 with 4 TB (0.8 DWPD) and the Intel P4610 with 3.2 TB (3 DWPD). I could get both for about the same price.

Although I probably would never fully utilize even the 0.8 DWPD, I still lean towards the P4610 because it’s “better.” However, I have now read that the P4610 is only approved for operation up to a temperature of 55 degrees Celsius, while the P4510 can handle up to 70 degrees Celsius.

Does anyone know how hot the U.2 NVMe drives get? Which one would you choose?

Best regards,
d1ck13

 

[nexox]

Those temperatures are in the operating environment section of the spec sheets I found, meaning they're maximum ambient, and I imagine you won't expose them to 55C or higher so it won't make a difference. The real decision comes down to workload - can the extra space of the p4510 do much to help performance of your cache, do you need the extra sustained write speed (especially random write) of the p4610?

 

[Chriggel]

In general, across different models and manufacturers, I found that U.2/U.3 drives get very hot compared to other storage devices, which isn't that surprising when you consider that their power consumption can be over 20 watts.
At the moment, I'm working with some Kioxia CM6 and they will run at ~15-25°C over ambient while in idle and putting a 120mm fan directly in front of it doesn't change as much as you'd think. In tight spaces without much airflow, you can expect ~35°C over ambient when idle, which isn't a problem, but could become one under heavy constant load.
Kioxia says that 70°C is acceptable and 80°C is the critical threshold, it seems to be similar for your Intel drives. It says that 0°C to 70°C is their operating temperature. Since the shape and size is determined by the standard and they're all made from similar components, I expect to see similar numbers for other drives as well. I wouldn't worry too much about these drives getting hot, they can handle it.

 

[d1ck13]

In principle, it doesn’t matter which model I choose. Currently, I have 1 TB of storage. I simply need at least double that.

I found the following information about the P4510:

https://www.servethehome.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/Intel-DC-P4510-and-P4511-Product-Specifications.jpg

The SSD throttles performance at 70 degrees Celsius and shuts down at 80 degrees Celsius. It seems that the P4610 will do this already at 55 degrees Celsius as this is the maximum temperature.

Although I’m still undecided, I’ll probably go with the P4510 unless someone shares their experiences with the P4610.

Best regards,
d1ck13

 

[nexox]

Chances are they'll thermal throttle at about the same internal temperature but the controller on the p4610 dissipates a little more power and thus heats up more for the same ambient temperature, but both of them only draw 15W at full (write) load, which is not terribly high for a U.2 drive, so cooling really shouldn't be difficult, especially if you're mostly reading or idling.

 

[Tech Junky]

Kioxia

Worth the investment as they run cooler. My CD8 idles around 40C which is alot cooler than others do.

I know some people with other drives that have to mount fans directly to them to even come close.

 

[nabsltd]

I have the choice between the Intel P4510 with 4 TB (0.8 DWPD) and the Intel P4610 with 3.2 TB (3 DWPD). I could get both for about the same price.

How much total storage (for which the NVMe will handle ingest/cache) do you have? The critical ratio is 400:1 storage to the one drive write per day NVMe size. At that point, you can completely re-write all your storage every year, and the NVMe will last its entire rated lifetime (5 years for Intel drives).

For the P4510, the size adjusted to 1DWPD is 3.2TB. So, if you have 40x that in storage (128TB), you can re-write all 128 TB every 5 weeks. For the P4610, the adjusted size is 9.6TB. If you have that same 128TB, you could re-write all the storage every 12 days.

If the operating temperature is worrisome, and you have less than about 300TB of storage, buy the P4510...it will last long enough that you'll likely replace the whole system before you run out of endurance.

 

[T_Minus]

IMO - The p4610 will slowdown to p4510 speeds at the 55 temp, but both operate up to the same temp "max".
The p4610 is > performance and thus heats faster and that performance will be throttled at the 55 temp, but the MAX operating temp of both should be the same IMO.

For a cache drive get the p4610 as it does > read\write performance (mixed) and will last longer if that's ever an issue.

As you said though likely both are fine

 

[DarkServant]

You can get an old WD Velociraptor WD3000GLFS (only this model!) on Ebay or elsewhere and use this "IcePack" called Heatsink with enough well placed thermal-pads. This will tame nearly all hot running U.2 SSD's.
Pssst, it's a secret

...and don't loose those four screws!

 

[Auggie]

You can get an old WD Velociraptor WD3000GLFS (only this model!) on Ebay or elsewhere and use this "IcePack" called Heatsink with enough well placed thermal-pads. This will tame nearly all hot running U.2 SSD's.
Pssst, it's a secret

...and don't loose those four screws!

or lose them, even

 

[Rand__]

Just to mention it, I've had drop P4610's out of a vsan array many times due to thermal issues.
Usually when they are under load, but not all the time.
But then, I cramped them with a P4800x in a tight space (2x2x6 inch or so) with only modest airflow (4x2,5" bay of Fujitsu TX1320), so I am not blaming them for getting hot.
A reboot usually fixes the problem, but for the summer I am looking at more cooling...