HP T730 8GB RAM 32GB Storage Thin Client

Discussion in 'Great Deals' started by MiniKnight, Aug 2, 2018.

  1. Cadal

    Cadal Member

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    Reckon these would be any good running parsec gaming client with a predator x34 (they seem to support 21:9 displays)?
     
    #61
  2. arglebargle

    arglebargle H̸̖̅ȩ̸̐l̷̦͋l̴̰̈ỏ̶̱ ̸̢͋W̵͖̌ò̴͚r̴͇̀l̵̼͗d̷͕̈

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    You might find this interesting: [GUIDE] Intel Intergrated graphic Passthrough

    Perhaps a similar approach would work with the integrated AMD GPU?
     
    #62
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2018
  3. arglebargle

    arglebargle H̸̖̅ȩ̸̐l̷̦͋l̴̰̈ỏ̶̱ ̸̢͋W̵͖̌ò̴͚r̴͇̀l̵̼͗d̷͕̈

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    I made a bootable EFI shell image for updating the BIOS without dicking about with ThinPro:
    T730_BIOS_01.11_RevA_bootable_EFI.img.xz

    Write to a USB stick, boot it in UEFI mode and the bios update is named L43_0111_uefiX64.efi in the root directory. I haven't tested this yet, my other machine won't be here for a few more days, but it should work fine. I used @fohdeesha's method for updating the T620 (thanks!)

    Does anyone know if it's worth the time to update the TPM module firmware? I tried just popping the .bin into \hp\devfw\tpm\TPMfirmware.bin on my bootable EFI stick but I think the BIOS is looking at the EFI partition on the SATA drive and doesn't find the image on USB.

    Here's HP's TPM firmware update advisory: HPSBHF03568 rev. 9 - Infineon TPM Security Update | HP® Customer Support
     
    #63
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  4. fake-name

    fake-name Active Member

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    Wow, the built-in NIC in these things is a trashfire:

    Code:
    [   13.150063] IPv6: ADDRCONF(NETDEV_CHANGE): enp1s0: link becomes ready
    [  257.745077] AMD-Vi: Event logged [IO_PAGE_FAULT device=01:00.0 domain=0x0003 address=0x0000000000004000 flags=0x0050]
    [  270.880407] ------------[ cut here ]------------
    [  270.880424] WARNING: CPU: 3 PID: 0 at /build/linux-3busU_/linux-4.4.0/net/sched/sch_generic.c:306 dev_watchdog+0x23d/0x250()
    [  270.880429] NETDEV WATCHDOG: enp1s0 (r8169): transmit queue 0 timed out
    [  270.880431] Modules linked in: binfmt_misc rpcsec_gss_krb5 auth_rpcgss nfsv4 nfs lockd grace fscache hp_wmi sparse_keymap kvm irqbypass snd_hda_codec_realtek snd_hda_codec_generic snd_hda_codec_hdmi edac_mce_amd serio_raw fam15h_power edac_core snd_hda_intel k10temp snd_hda_codec i2c_piix4 joydev input_leds snd_hda_core snd_hwdep snd_pcm snd_timer snd shpchp soundcore mac_hid sunrpc ib_iser rdma_cm iw_cm ib_cm ib_sa ib_mad ib_core ib_addr iscsi_tcp libiscsi_tcp libiscsi scsi_transport_iscsi autofs4 btrfs raid10 raid456 async_raid6_recov async_memcpy async_pq async_xor async_tx xor raid6_pq libcrc32c raid1 raid0 multipath linear pata_acpi hid_generic amdkfd crct10dif_pclmul amd_iommu_v2 crc32_pclmul ghash_clmulni_intel radeon aesni_intel aes_x86_64 lrw gf128mul glue_helper ablk_helper cryptd i2c_algo_bit
    [  270.880524]  ttm psmouse drm_kms_helper syscopyarea sysfillrect usbhid pata_atiixp sysimgblt ahci fb_sys_fops hid libahci drm r8169 mii wmi fjes video
    [  270.880549] CPU: 3 PID: 0 Comm: swapper/3 Not tainted 4.4.0-133-generic #159-Ubuntu
    [  270.880553] Hardware name: HP HP t730 Thin Client/8103, BIOS L43 v01.08 03/21/2017
    [  270.880556]  0000000000000286 f0ee371fe96c68ed ffff88013ed83d98 ffffffff814032d3
    [  270.880562]  ffff88013ed83de0 ffffffff81d751a0 ffff88013ed83dd0 ffffffff81084992
    [  270.880567]  0000000000000000 ffff88008f9f5a80 0000000000000003 ffff880098304000
    [  270.880572] Call Trace:
    [  270.880576]  <IRQ>  [<ffffffff814032d3>] dump_stack+0x63/0x90
    [  270.880592]  [<ffffffff81084992>] warn_slowpath_common+0x82/0xc0
    [  270.880597]  [<ffffffff81084a2c>] warn_slowpath_fmt+0x5c/0x80
    [  270.880604]  [<ffffffff8176dd8d>] dev_watchdog+0x23d/0x250
    [  270.880609]  [<ffffffff8176db50>] ? dev_deactivate_queue.constprop.33+0x60/0x60
    [  270.880615]  [<ffffffff810f1997>] call_timer_fn+0x37/0x130
    [  270.880620]  [<ffffffff8176db50>] ? dev_deactivate_queue.constprop.33+0x60/0x60
    [  270.880625]  [<ffffffff810f217d>] run_timer_softirq+0x23d/0x2f0
    [  270.880630]  [<ffffffff81089839>] __do_softirq+0x109/0x2b0
    [  270.880634]  [<ffffffff81089b55>] irq_exit+0xa5/0xb0
    [  270.880642]  [<ffffffff81857840>] smp_apic_timer_interrupt+0x50/0x60
    [  270.880647]  [<ffffffff818551ff>] apic_timer_interrupt+0xbf/0xd0
    [  270.880649]  <EOI>  [<ffffffff816e432e>] ? cpuidle_enter_state+0x11e/0x2d0
    [  270.880660]  [<ffffffff816e4517>] cpuidle_enter+0x17/0x20
    [  270.880666]  [<ffffffff810c8c12>] call_cpuidle+0x32/0x60
    [  270.880671]  [<ffffffff816e44f9>] ? cpuidle_select+0x19/0x20
    [  270.880675]  [<ffffffff810c8ed6>] cpu_startup_entry+0x296/0x360
    [  270.880681]  [<ffffffff81052fa7>] start_secondary+0x177/0x1b0
    [  270.880685] ---[ end trace b368f53ef80520c9 ]---
    [  270.899271] r8169 0000:01:00.0 enp1s0: link up
    [  278.777192] AMD-Vi: Event logged [IO_PAGE_FAULT device=01:00.0 domain=0x0003 address=0x0000000000004000 flags=0x0050]
    [  300.908699] r8169 0000:01:00.0 enp1s0: link up
    
    If you load it hard, it shits the bed every few minutes, and sometimes doesn't come back at all.

    ****ing realtek.
     
    #64
  5. arglebargle

    arglebargle H̸̖̅ȩ̸̐l̷̦͋l̴̰̈ỏ̶̱ ̸̢͋W̵͖̌ò̴͚r̴͇̀l̵̼͗d̷͕̈

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    That's pretty much exactly what the dual Realtek interface on my J1900 does. It was fine when my ISP link was 60/5 but now that I've got symmetric gigabit it shits itself pretty regularly.
     
    #65
  6. WANg

    WANg Active Member

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    You might need to hunt down the dkms drivers from Realtek and install that instead. The bundled drivers are a known headache for the past few years.
     
    #66
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  7. arglebargle

    arglebargle H̸̖̅ȩ̸̐l̷̦͋l̴̰̈ỏ̶̱ ̸̢͋W̵͖̌ò̴͚r̴͇̀l̵̼͗d̷͕̈

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    It's also worth hunting down the Realtek BSD drivers and compiling them if you're running pfsense. I've followed these instructions here:
    compile realtek network driver for pfsense 2.4.x

    Switch out the BSD version for whichever your pfsense version is based on. I've built on FreeBSD 10.3 and 11 successfully.

    @fake-name What OS were you running where the adapter crapped itself? I've already built the Realtek dkms driver and I'm running a 15 minute iperf3 across it now, I'll reboot and load the stock driver and test that one when this is done.
     
    #67
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2018
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  8. WANg

    WANg Active Member

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    Probably? AMD designed the SoC to act as arcade and gaming (video slot/video poker) boards targeting integrators like EGT, IGT, Konami and Sega. Hell, if I get a second one at a reasonable price I'll test it as a standalone MAME machine - I bet it'll do quite well provided there are decent video drivers.
     
    #68
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  9. WANg

    WANg Active Member

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    Heh, is it still crapulent with their drivers, or do you see a substantial improvement? I can tell you from experience that even on a decent machine with Win7, Gigabit transfers will still peg a machine with 70% CPU utilization. Man, I miss the days where notebooks are bundled with Broadcom Tigons and 3Com NICs. Realteks and Marvells are not stuff you find on network gear for a good reason.
     
    #69
  10. arglebargle

    arglebargle H̸̖̅ȩ̸̐l̷̦͋l̴̰̈ỏ̶̱ ̸̢͋W̵͖̌ò̴͚r̴͇̀l̵̼͗d̷͕̈

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    The DKMS driver was rock solid while blasting full line rate through it for 15 minutes straight. The normal Debian package won't install on Proxmox 5.2 though, there was a breaking change in kernel 4.15, so you need the package from Buster or Sid.

    Code:
    root@bill:~# dmesg | grep r8168
    [    3.845568] r8168: loading out-of-tree module taints kernel.
    [    3.847272] r8168 Gigabit Ethernet driver 8.046.00-NAPI loaded
    [    3.863277] r8168: This product is covered by one or more of the following patents: US6,570,884, US6,115,776, and US6,327,625.
    [    3.863288] r8168  Copyright (C) 2018  Realtek NIC software team <nicfae@realtek.com> 
    [    3.918932] r8168 0000:02:00.0 enp2s0: renamed from eth0
    [   16.138544] r8168: enp2s0: link up
    ...
    root@bill:~# iperf3 -c meta -t 900
    ...
    [  4] 889.00-890.00 sec   112 MBytes   941 Mbits/sec    0   3.01 MBytes       
    [  4] 890.00-891.00 sec   112 MBytes   941 Mbits/sec    0   3.01 MBytes       
    [  4] 891.00-892.00 sec   112 MBytes   941 Mbits/sec    0   3.01 MBytes       
    [  4] 892.00-893.00 sec   112 MBytes   941 Mbits/sec    0   3.01 MBytes       
    [  4] 893.00-894.00 sec   112 MBytes   942 Mbits/sec    0   3.01 MBytes       
    [  4] 894.00-895.00 sec   112 MBytes   941 Mbits/sec    0   3.01 MBytes       
    [  4] 895.00-896.00 sec   112 MBytes   942 Mbits/sec    0   3.01 MBytes       
    [  4] 896.00-897.00 sec   112 MBytes   941 Mbits/sec    0   3.01 MBytes       
    [  4] 897.00-898.00 sec   112 MBytes   942 Mbits/sec    0   3.01 MBytes       
    [  4] 898.00-899.00 sec   112 MBytes   941 Mbits/sec    0   3.01 MBytes       
    [  4] 899.00-900.00 sec   112 MBytes   936 Mbits/sec    0   3.01 MBytes       
    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    [ ID] Interval           Transfer     Bandwidth       Retr
    [  4]   0.00-900.00 sec  98.6 GBytes   941 Mbits/sec    0             sender
    [  4]   0.00-900.00 sec  98.6 GBytes   941 Mbits/sec                  receiver
    iperf Done.
    
    I'm actually about to start testing the stock kernel driver right now, I'll update in a bit.
     
    #70
  11. fake-name

    fake-name Active Member

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    @arglebargle - Ubuntu Server 16.04 LTS.

    If there are non-shit drivers, why the hell haven't they been merged into the kernel mainline? What the hell?
     
    #71
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  12. arglebargle

    arglebargle H̸̖̅ȩ̸̐l̷̦͋l̴̰̈ỏ̶̱ ̸̢͋W̵͖̌ò̴͚r̴͇̀l̵̼͗d̷͕̈

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    I ask that every time I install Ubuntu and have to plug a lan cable into the machine because the wifi drivers are shit.

    Don't even get me started on the realtek drivers pfsense ships with, holy ****.
     
    #72
  13. WANg

    WANg Active Member

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    Licensing, mostly. A significant chunk of Linux drivers out there are either reverse engineered (usually kinda buggy or slow unless it matured over the years), or is just a bunch of code shim talking to a binary blob interfacing with the hardware (faster but much less flexible, and dependent on the whims of driver developers hacking shims to get it to work) - it's getting increasingly rare for Linux driver devs to get register level specs on hardware.
     
    #73
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2018
  14. arglebargle

    arglebargle H̸̖̅ȩ̸̐l̷̦͋l̴̰̈ỏ̶̱ ̸̢͋W̵͖̌ò̴͚r̴͇̀l̵̼͗d̷͕̈

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    Code:
    ...
    [  4] 892.00-893.00 sec   112 MBytes   941 Mbits/sec    0   1.99 MBytes      
    [  4] 893.00-894.00 sec   112 MBytes   936 Mbits/sec    0   1.99 MBytes      
    [  4] 894.00-895.00 sec   112 MBytes   941 Mbits/sec    0   1.99 MBytes      
    [  4] 895.00-896.00 sec   112 MBytes   941 Mbits/sec    0   1.99 MBytes      
    [  4] 896.00-897.00 sec   111 MBytes   934 Mbits/sec    0   1.99 MBytes      
    [  4] 897.00-898.00 sec   112 MBytes   938 Mbits/sec    0   1.99 MBytes      
    [  4] 898.00-899.00 sec   112 MBytes   941 Mbits/sec    0   1.99 MBytes      
    [  4] 899.00-900.00 sec   112 MBytes   941 Mbits/sec    0   1.99 MBytes      
    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    [ ID] Interval           Transfer     Bandwidth       Retr
    [  4]   0.00-900.00 sec  98.6 GBytes   941 Mbits/sec    0             sender
    [  4]   0.00-900.00 sec  98.6 GBytes   941 Mbits/sec                  receiver
    iperf Done.
    
    Well, I'm not sure what's up with the Ubuntu 16.04 drivers. I just ran 15 minutes of iperf through the stock r816* driver that ships with proxmox and it functioned flawlessly.

    Code:
    root@bill:~# uname -a
    Linux bill 4.15.18-2-pve #1 SMP PVE 4.15.18-20 (Thu, 16 Aug 2018 11:06:35 +0200) x86_64 GNU/Linux
    root@bill:~# lsmod | grep ^r
    radeon               1474560  1
    rdma_cm                61440  1 ib_iser
    raid6_pq              114688  1 btrfs
    r8169                  86016  0
    root@bill:~# dmesg | grep r816
    [    3.785421] r8169 Gigabit Ethernet driver 2.3LK-NAPI loaded
    [    3.797502] r8169 0000:02:00.0 eth0: RTL8168h/8111h at 0x        (ptrval), -, XID 14100800 IRQ 43
    [    3.797508] r8169 0000:02:00.0 eth0: jumbo features [frames: 9200 bytes, tx checksumming: ko]
    [    3.845545] r8169 0000:02:00.0 enp2s0: renamed from eth0
    [   13.083028] r8169 0000:02:00.0 enp2s0: link down
    [   13.083061] r8169 0000:02:00.0 enp2s0: link down
    [   16.179296] r8169 0000:02:00.0 enp2s0: link up
    root@bill:~#
    
    This is the module that ships with proxmox, no fancy DKMS package ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
     
    #74
  15. WANg

    WANg Active Member

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    iperf it up first for like 10 minutes and see how it performs. Either the default drivers improved significantly in the past 2-3 years, or someone merged the vendor driver upstream. Either ways, I still prefer anything other than Marvell/Realtek if I can help it.
     
    #75
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2018
  16. arglebargle

    arglebargle H̸̖̅ȩ̸̐l̷̦͋l̴̰̈ỏ̶̱ ̸̢͋W̵͖̌ò̴͚r̴͇̀l̵̼͗d̷͕̈

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    Yeah, that's the tail end of 15 minutes of 1Gbps iperf traffic, note the timestamps before the summary, it was totally fine the entire time.

    I only planned to use the onboard nic as a fallback management interface in case a kernel update broke the Mellanox DKMS drivers but it seems like the Realtek is pretty alright.
     
    #76
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  17. WeekendWarrior

    WeekendWarrior Active Member

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    Not to hijack the thread, but some Lenovo thin clients may be better than the T730 for general computing at the same price point.

    For example: Lenovo ThinkCentre M93P Tiny Core i5-4570T 3.30GHz 4GB 500GB Desktop Computer PC | eBay. I just picked up a couple m93s with 8GB and a SSD and Win7 pro for $165 each.

    Although some ThinkCentre "Tiny" (i.e., thin client) models have low-end components, the m93p has an Intel 82579 based NIC. An online component list is available. See page 186 at http://content.etilize.com/Manufacturer-Brochure/1026992540.pdf.

    The idle power of the m93p will be higher than the HP/AMD units, which may factor into pfSense use, but otherwise m93p looks good.
     
    #77
  18. WANg

    WANg Active Member

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    The M93p doesn't have a PCIe x16 slot, which is the big draw of the t620Plus/t730 thin clients - since you'll be able to drop quadport 1GbE and dualport 10GbE NICs in there and then segregate it to various VMs via PCIe VFs. You can't do that on NUC/NUC-like chassis in general. Also, from a "fun" perspective, the t730 supports quad displays via its 4 Displayports. I doubt that many of those mini PCs can do that as well.

    If it's general computing on a NUC-like chassis, there are alternatives similar to the m93 like the HP EliteDesk 800G2 Minis or the Dell Optiplex 7050 Micro and the like.
     
    #78
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  19. arglebargle

    arglebargle H̸̖̅ȩ̸̐l̷̦͋l̴̰̈ỏ̶̱ ̸̢͋W̵͖̌ò̴͚r̴͇̀l̵̼͗d̷͕̈

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    The pcie slot is the key to these machines. With a 10GbE nic you have the bandwidth to exploit the SSD for clustered storage in addition to the pfsense role.
     
    #79
  20. WANg

    WANg Active Member

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    Okay, so I had some additional time over the weekend to do some testing - although not the testing that I wanted to do. I was able to load a Windows 10 1803 image on a 256GB SSD and got the Thin client to boot off it. I then loaded the standard t730 driver pack for Windows 10 and proceeded upon some hardware performance testing - mostly to see how well the Radeon R7 on the RX427BB performs. Unfortunately the Windows 10 install doesn't seem very stable as I constantly observe system crashes (no such issue is seen in Linux or ESXi, the machine had been rock solid to me). That being said, I was able to get the following metrics:

    3DMarksVantage
    P6588 (6257 GPU/7831 CPU)
    P6623 (6259 GPU/8023 CPU)
    P6603 (6258 GPU/7956 CPU)

    3DMarks05
    11112

    Note that I didn't have a chance to install 3DMarks11 - but I would say that normal gaming/performance will be similar to the performance of an A8Pro-9600 (which is the same as the HP mt43 mobile thin client - I wouldn't recommend buying one as the mt44 client is Ryzen based and will drop in price quickly once the mt45 comes out)
     
    #80
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