Fujitsu Futro S920 Thin Client as opnsense firewall

[nelo3]

anyone wanna try put two pci slot?




i need 15 watts per PCI

30 watts two pci

 

[rubicoin]

Ok, my S920 build is kinda done:


OpenWRT running flawlessly for 48 hours now with the above-mentioned 4-port 2.5Gb NIC from Aliexpress installed via the ADT-Link flexible riser.
Currently it's only doing basic NAT/routing for my 1Gb Internet service/2.5Gb LAN (connected to a 5-port TP-Link 2.5G switch, while WiFi is provided by a cheap TP-Link AX router in AP mode).

I'm curious if it would be a futureproof setup for a 2Gb+ Internet service? Is there an easy but realistic way to test the raw networking power of the CPU?

 

[pflaume]

Wolfgang on YouTube tested the S920 with a 10G card, you should be able to run 2.5G. He also shows how he tested the throughput with iperf.

 

[rubicoin]

Wolfgang on YouTube tested the S920 with a 10G card, you should be able to run 2.5G. He also shows how he tested the throughput with iperf.

Thanks I've seen that, he managed to reach ~6Gb speeeds, but I did not try iperf myself. Could not find out how to do it properly.

 

[pflaume]

Thanks I've seen that, he managed to reach ~6Gb speeeds, but I did not try iperf myself. Could not find out how to do it properly.

Thats also just raw throughput, I'm curious what the S920 / S930 can push with IPS / IDS enabled.


I just replaced my Sophos XG115 with a S930 with the 2.4 GHz quad-core GX-424CC running Sophos XG Home. I installed the Intel i340-T4 and it runs flawlessly. Couldn't get it to work with a Pro/1000 4-port NIC, but the i340 works, runs way cooler and consumes less power.

 

[fanoush]

There are ItemIDs for slot speeds in GabiSettings.cfg. If you feel adventurous you could try the bios tools I linked.
ItemID = 011E, Slot 1 Link Speed
ItemID = 011F, Slot 2 Link Speed
ItemID = 0120, Slot 3 Link Speed
ItemID = 0121, Slot 4 Link Speed

I had same issue with S920 - pci-e was stuck on gen1 2.5GT/s and I managed to fix it with EditCMOS and now I get gen2 speed - 5GT/s

It is not about values listed above but it is possible to save existing values from bios
EditCMOS save=save.txt
then if you check values near end there is one set to 0x152
from GabiSettings.cfg the item is related to pcie power and values are 1x151 high, 0x152 low
I have set it to 0x151 in freedos, rebooted to linux and now all pcie slots show speed 5GT/s and for 2.5devices speed is marked as downgraded.
I also tried gen2 card and it works, speed is reported as 5GT/s

EDIT: found exact names
ItemID = 01B7, PSPP Policy (PCIe Speed Power Policy)
ValueID = 0151, Balanced-High
ValueID = 0152, Balanced-Low

 

[tbfutro22]

Hello fanoush, very interesting! o)

I also dived into the PCIe port speed issue and can confirm, the 4x slot will run at Gen1 speed by default (which "only" gives around 900 MB/s with the NVMe drive I connected, which is a 4x PCIe-Gen3 card). If the port would run at Gen3 speed, read/write speeds of the NVMe would get to around 3600 MB/s (4 times faster than Gen1). I was a bit dissapointed to see the s920 not making use of PCIe-Gen3. I tried some tweaking and tested with different cards, but nope! The outer PCIe-4x slot and the miniPCIe-1x slot in the middle are stuck at Gen1 mode for some reason.

Now you say you can tweak BIOS settings to get at least Gen2 speed on the ports? Did I understand you correctly? o)
I would appreciate if you provide some more details on this, I downloaded the tools from the post you qouted and had close look at GabiSettings and EditCMOS files, but this does not make much sense to me yet.

How did you match ValueID 0151 to be a proper setting for ItemID 01B7 e.g.?
Could you post the specific command to alter the "PCIe speed power policy" to "Balanced-High"?

EDIT: Would it be like this?

> EditCMOS.exe SetID:0x01B7=0x0151

Thank you! o)

 

[fanoush]

Yes, this is exactly what I did. I first saved existing values to file via "EditCMOS.exe save=file.txt" then checked gabisettings.cfg file what those items and values mean and found it. then I tried GetID first and then SetID, to set it, then getid to check it is saved as 151 now. then I rebooted to linux and checked via 'sudo lspci -vvv |less" that the pcie bridges report speed as 5GT/s and random card I tried (VIA805 4x USB 3.0) report speed as 5GT/s too and existing wifi and ethernet report 2.5GT/s as "(downgraded)", previously there was "(ok)" as the parent pci-e bridge port was not faster.

I used FreeDOS bootable usb that I previously used to upgrade bios to latest ( V4.6.5.4 - R1.16.0 (13/08/2018)) . I have the D3313-G1 board with GX222-GC dual core CPU.

 

[tbfutro22]

Ok, thank you very much, I will try this out! o)

There is no table or some kind of command to actually find/get all accepted values for a setting, or is there? You found "0152, Balanced-Low" for the "01B7, PSPP Policy (PCIe Speed Power Policy)" setting and just tried "0151, Balanced-High", because it was listed nearby. If there is another setting, to also enable Gen3 mode, we would not know, is this right? Same applies to other settings, how do you know whether a setting accepts "On" and "Off" or "Auto", "Enhanced" etc.? That's probably something only the manufacturer knows for sure?

Anyway, thank you! o)

 

[fanoush]

So I did it yesterday and today I got pcie 4x to M2 adapter and Micron 2450 512GB NVME SSD and the speed is not exactly great. Maybe there is a reason such high pci-e speeds are not enabled. Here is test of speed at 4x 5GT/s

ubuntu@ubuntu:~$ sudo dd if=/dev/nvme0n1 of=/dev/null bs=1M count=10000
10000+0 records in
10000+0 records out
10485760000 bytes (10 GB, 9.8 GiB) copied, 14.4331 s, 727 MB/s

when booting it says
[ 0.508539] pci 0000:01:00.0: 16.000 Gb/s available PCIe bandwidth, limited by 5.0 GT/s PCIe x4 link at 0000:00:02.1 (capable of 63.012 Gb/s with 16.0 GT/s PCIe x4 link)

lspci says

00:02.1 PCI bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Family 16h Processor Functions 5:1 (prog-if 00 [Normal decode])
...
LnkCap: Port #0, Speed 5GT/s, Width x4, ASPM L0s L1, Exit Latency L0s <512ns, L1 <64us
ClockPM- Surprise- LLActRep+ BwNot+ ASPMOptComp+
LnkCtl: ASPM L1 Enabled; RCB 64 bytes, Disabled- CommClk+
ExtSynch- ClockPM- AutWidDis- BWInt- AutBWInt-
LnkSta: Speed 5GT/s (ok), Width x4 (ok)
TrErr- Train- SlotClk+ DLActive+ BWMgmt+ ABWMgmt-
...
01:00.0 Non-Volatile memory controller: Micron Technology Inc Device 5411 (rev 01) (prog-if 02 [NVM Express])
Subsystem: Micron Technology Inc Device 1100
...
LnkCap: Port #1, Speed 16GT/s, Width x4, ASPM L1, Exit Latency L1 unlimited
ClockPM- Surprise- LLActRep- BwNot- ASPMOptComp+
LnkCtl: ASPM L1 Enabled; RCB 64 bytes, Disabled- CommClk+
ExtSynch- ClockPM- AutWidDis- BWInt- AutBWInt-
LnkSta: Speed 5GT/s (downgraded), Width x4 (ok)
TrErr- Train- SlotClk+ DLActive- BWMgmt- ABWMgmt-


I already tested this SSD still with gen1 and it was slower but not that much (maybe 500-600MB?)

So I guess there is some other bottleneck - cpu or chipset. This ssd does 4-5GB/s in my current laptop with gen4. i don't have any 'slower' (gen3 or gen2) SSD to test now.

This is latest ubuntu 22.04 LTS, kernel 5.15.0-67-generic.

I wonder how it improves those networking cards people benchmarked here previously.


EDIT:
Oh, BTW the block size makes some difference, 128K being the best

ubuntu@ubuntu:~$ sudo dd if=/dev/nvme0n1 of=/dev/null bs=64K count=100000
100000+0 records in
100000+0 records out
6553600000 bytes (6.6 GB, 6.1 GiB) copied, 7.29548 s, 898 MB/s

ubuntu@ubuntu:~$ sudo dd if=/dev/nvme0n1 of=/dev/null bs=32K count=100000
100000+0 records in
100000+0 records out
3276800000 bytes (3.3 GB, 3.1 GiB) copied, 3.73048 s, 878 MB/s

ubuntu@ubuntu:~$ sudo dd if=/dev/nvme0n1 of=/dev/null bs=128K count=100000
100000+0 records in
100000+0 records out
13107200000 bytes (13 GB, 12 GiB) copied, 13.6644 s, 959 MB/s

ubuntu@ubuntu:~$ sudo dd if=/dev/nvme0n1 of=/dev/null bs=256K count=100000
100000+0 records in
100000+0 records out
26214400000 bytes (26 GB, 24 GiB) copied, 27.5715 s, 951 MB/s

 

[tbfutro22]

Mhh.. 900 and something MB/s is what I already get here in Gen1 mode (using CrystalDiskMark on Windows), I will test and post my results with the BIOS setting adjusted, but not within the next few days unfortunately, since a lot of stuff is in the queue. I'm not quite sure yet what is going on with NVMe drives in PCIe M.2 adapters, my tests with the same drive on "real" Gen2 and Gen3 ATX motherboards where not satisfactory either and even slower than on the s920 (those tests ended at around 750 MB/s, for some other yet unknown reason o).

FWIW, my drive is a 0.5TB Samsung 980 MZ-V8V500BW.

 

[cBorisa]

Yep, I eventually found something concrete from some spare parts site. Fujitsu code for the plastic retainer is V26827-B443-V250 in case someone else wants to go for the original. Availability and prices in EU are so-so and I’ll purchase something similar but cheaper like generic stand-off pieces.

I have one piece available in Germany. I can send it to you per post if you want .

 

[Samir]

The S920 which I have got AMD GX-424CC which is consumes more power than GX 415-GA. This website says that ( https://www.cpu-world.com/Compare/301/AMD_G-Series_GX-415GA_vs_AMD_G-Series_GX-424CC.html ) GX-415 GA is 40% more power efficient. I am planning to replace the S920 CPU with GX-415 GA. I plan to get 415-GA from an old HP 620 thin client. Any thoughts on this approach?. Do you think I can some power with CPU swap?

EDIT: Looks like I cannot remove the CPU and seems to fixed permanently!

You can always just get another thin client that uses the 415ga, but you're also going to see nearly 40% less single thread performance:

AMD GX-415GA SOC vs GX-424CC SOC [cpubenchmark.net] by PassMark Software

Personally, I have thin clients with both the 424cc and the 415ga (both being used as thin clients), and the 424cc blows the 415ga out of the water in terms of performance.

 

[fanoush]

Mhh.. 900 and something MB/s is what I already get here in Gen1 mode (using CrystalDiskMark on Windows), I will test and post my results with the BIOS setting adjusted, but not within the next few days unfortunately, since a lot of stuff is in the queue. I'm not quite sure yet what is going on with NVMe drives in PCIe M.2 adapters, my tests with the same drive on "real" Gen2 and Gen3 ATX motherboards where not satisfactory either and even slower than on the s920 (those tests ended at around 750 MB/s, for some other yet unknown reason o).

FWIW, my drive is a 0.5TB Samsung 980 MZ-V8V500BW.

I have installed Windows 10 and here is the nvme drive speed

And BTW I used this NVME adapter https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004793473975.html it is very narrow so it fits right in the slot and the case can be closed. Also it extends to the other side than normal pcie cards so you don't need to cut the metal case to insert it.

Also now I see there is this one https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000722946278.html which has the ssd maybe on better side - faces up, but I did not try it so don't know whether it is narrow enough too. I guess I'll order it.

 

[tbfutro22]

This looks promising! o) Thank you, I did not try for myself yet unfortunately, but I will get to it eventually.. o)
The links you posted to the adapters, they do not work for me, I don't know why. I even tried copying the item ids from your urls into random items I clicked on aliexpress, but to no avail. Maybe it's a geolocation block or something.. o)

 

[fanoush]

This looks promising! o) Thank you, I did not try for myself yet unfortunately, but I will get to it eventually.. o)
The links you posted to the adapters, they do not work for me, I don't know why. I even tried copying the item ids from your urls into random items I clicked on aliexpress, but to no avail. Maybe it's a geolocation block or something.. o)

they do work for me when clicked in my post

 

[tbfutro22]

Weird, there is indeed some kind of geolocation block going on.. I just recognized the small text on the error page:

 

[oxide]

Can anyone with the GX-222GC CPU share what temps they hit with the passive cooler? Or if they have any cooling solution in place? My unit tends to hit ~85c (~27ish in my room) after replacing the thermal paste, no bandwidth through it just idling in the web UI of opnsense, wondering if I should do anything to help it out a lil. Ty!

Replying to my own post after a long time but the issue I found was disabled c-states in bios - explains why the processor was always running so hot. If anyone has these problems, double check your bios settings!

 

[lexxnsk]

Do you think it is possible to use Coral TPU in mini PCIE slot?
This one https://eu.mouser.com/ProductDetail/212-G650-04528-01

 

[tbfutro22]

I can't think of any reason the TPU thing should not work in the mini PCIe connector (I'm no expert in PCI specs though, keep that in mind.. o).
I tested a full size GPU in that mini PCIe connector recently and an NVME drive, these two devices worked as expected (for me at least).