Brocade ICX Series (cheap & powerful 10gbE/40gbE switching)

Discussion in 'Networking' started by fohdeesha, Jul 12, 2018.

  1. Smbaker

    Smbaker New Member

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    My ICX6450-24P with Sunon fan mod is sitting at 56.5 degrees on Sensor B and 60.5 degrees on Sensor A. Currently running at fan speed 1. This is with four PoE cams, a PoE Access point, and a PoE Raspberry pi. About 30 watts of PoE total. Plus about a dozen ports of regular Ethernet.

    This is only about 3.5 degrees away from engaging fan speed 2, which happens at 64C.

    Is there a way to see the fan RPMs on this switch?

    Do these temperatures seem reasonable for a modded unit? Nothing to worry about?
     
    #2361
  2. fohdeesha

    fohdeesha Kaini Industries

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    those temps are fine, as you said it hasn't even decided it's warm enough to kick up to speed 2. If it's trying to run speed 2 all the time and approaching warning temp, that's when you should start to worry

    there's a hidden debug command to get raw fan RPM, but I can't remember if it works on the 6450:

    dm fan-speed
     
    #2362
  3. kzoo

    kzoo New Member

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    Thanks to all of your hard work, I have an ICX7450 on the way, and I may be getting an ICX6450. So yes, I may be asking you for a license soon!
     
    #2363
  4. tojoski

    tojoski New Member

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    I might, I haven't gotten that far with mine yet.

    I did find and order a suitable set of fans.. These are 7.7CFM @ 21DB, have the RD output and best of all available from a reputable seller.

    MF40201V2-1000U-A99 Sunon Fans | Fans, Thermal Management | DigiKey
     
    #2364
  5. Terry Wallace

    Terry Wallace PsyOps SysOp

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    Thanks to you I have so much brocade equipment I now only buy Licenses if they have switches attached...:)
     
    #2365
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  6. Smbaker

    Smbaker New Member

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    Thanks, I tried that though I'm not sure if the answer is useful:

    Code:
    SSH@ICX6450-24P-Router#dm fan-speed   
    All fans in Low speed (0x83)
    
    Not sure if 0x83 is the sensed RPM, the output PWM, or something else. Will be interesting to check it if/when it revs up to speed 2.
     
    #2366
  7. juey

    juey Member

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    You can also buy Noctua NF-A4x20 FLX fans, i have modded 3 6450-24p with these without any issue, one switch is pulling 60W of power over PoE and the fan speed stays at 1. I have one switch running next to me, its dead quiet.

    6450fanswap2.jpg
     
    #2367
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2019
  8. tojoski

    tojoski New Member

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    I thought I read here that the Noctuas wouldn't start at the lowest fan level 4.5v?

    I was also under the impression that it needed the locked rotor detection.
     
    #2368
  9. juey

    juey Member

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    They do spin up
     
    #2369
  10. infoMatt

    infoMatt Member

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    These switches (and for what matters, almost all the "enterprise-y" equipment that I've used/seen/dealt with) boot with the fans at full blast, and throttle them down when the OS takes full control, so no problem if the fans cannot start at 4V or so - they do need of course to be able to maintain the rotation at low voltage, not to overcome the initial inertia ;)
     
    #2370
  11. fohdeesha

    fohdeesha Kaini Industries

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    ok yeah I thought I vaguely remembered the output being weird on the 6450, on the 6610 it's just RPM:


    Code:
    telnet@ICX1(config-if-e1000-1/1/20)#dm fan-speed
    FRU 1 Fan 1 Speed at 8490 RPM.
    FRU 1 Fan 2 Speed at 8766 RPM.
    
    0x83 is 131 in decimal, so I have no idea what it would be. Was thinking maybe a scale from 0-100% PWM but clearly not
     
    #2371
  12. Smbaker

    Smbaker New Member

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    It could be 0-255, that might make sense.

    I could go stick a piece of painter's tape over the fan outlets, let the unit warm up a bit, and see if the values change.
     
    #2372
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  13. Smbaker

    Smbaker New Member

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    The painter's tape experiment has concluded:

    Code:
    SSH@ICX6450-24P-Router#dm fan-speed
    All fans in High speed (0xff)
    I think this is PWM, on a 0-255 scale, or it's something being fed into an 8-bit DAC to drive the fan voltage, whatever. 0x83 = about half, 0xFF = wide open. Mystery solved, though I do wish it told me the RPM instead.

    Oh, and even these "quiet" Sunons can be heard across the room when they're running wide open.
     
    #2373
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  14. fohdeesha

    fohdeesha Kaini Industries

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    That's definitely the case then, I remember reading the voltage and it was around half at fan speed 1
     
    #2374
  15. zanechua

    zanechua Member

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    I would not recommend the Noctua's... I made the mistake of buying Noctua's 40mm's and that turned out to be a bad idea. They just don't produce enough cfm to be able to cool anything. They are great fans but probably the wrong use case.


    I have a ICX7450 coming and I have a ton of 40mm fans... Onus to me trying to make everything silent on a new build of mine. I'll probably try them out if the ICX7450 is too noisy. I do need to check the PSU to make sure they can handle the fans though in terms of power consumption.
     
    #2375
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2019
  16. Todd F

    Todd F New Member

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    Good timing for this part of the thread. I recently received a ICX7250. I ordered 2x Noctua A4x20-FLX. At boot, these spun up no problem, but once the system was booted, the fans would come to a stop and the system would reboot due to both failed fans. These run very quiet at 12V so just running them at max voltage would be acceptable, but you'd still need at least 1 fan going so the system understood there was at least 1 working fan. I played with the idea of ordering some PWM generator to trick the switch, but that seemed a bit fiddly and I'd need to get out the o-scope and make measurements.

    So on to Digikey I went. I found contenders with high RPM @ 12V but <= 40dB. Stock fans are ~55dB. I wanted to try fans with higher RPM to have the best chance of fooling FastIron into thinking it had the correct fans installed so I wouldn't see them failed. I'll give the relevant specs then my thoughts.

    Sunon MF40101VX-1000U-G99:
    - 10mm thick vs 28mm for originals
    - 'super high' speed fan,
    - 4.5 min voltage range on the sheet. Once started, I could run this to ~4V.
    - 8500 RPM
    - 9.9 CFM
    - 31.4 db(A)
    - $7.66

    Mechatronics MR4020X12B1-RSR:
    - 20mm thick
    - No min voltage specified, once started, I could run this to ~4V.
    - 12,000 RPM
    - 17.2 CFM
    - 41.0 dB(A)
    - $9.60


    Both fans operate normally and the system see them operating properly. Unlike the Noctua fans which were reported as 'Failed'. This Sunon is nearly silent in Speed 1, Speed 2 isn't bad either. Air flow is... OK. The Mechatronics fan is fairly loud on boot and reasonable in Speed 1. It's not silent but the airflow is pretty good. I don't feel like it's starving the switch for air movement.

    I'm not sure if I want to try out more fans since I'll have a fleet of 40mm fans with no real use for them. I think many here can sympathize with the need to have things 'just right.' If I did try a few more, I might look at Delta Electronics AFB0412HHB-F00 (11.5CFM @ 32dB(A)), Sunon MF40201VX-1000U-G99 (10.8 CFM @ 37.5dbA).
     
    #2376
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  17. tojoski

    tojoski New Member

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    Well the fans I ordered from Digikey are only 2-wire and don't have the connector. #facepalm

    Can anyone confirm whether these need the RPM type output, or the RD output (rotation detection)?
     
    #2377
  18. fohdeesha

    fohdeesha Kaini Industries

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    without RPM output it will think the fans have failed. on the icx6450 and icx7250 theyll still boot and run
     
    #2378
  19. Thomas H

    Thomas H Member

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    Picked up a ICX-6450 unit on eBay. Do I have a defective unit with PoE problem?

    From web GUI:
    Under Inline Power Statistics, I see four "PD Detection Fault"

    From console (reload):
    Code:
    Stack unit 1 PS 1, Internal Power supply detected and up.
    
    Stack unit 1 PS 1, Internal Power supply detected and up.
    PoE: Stack unit 1 PS 1, Internal Power supply  with 740000 mwatts capacity is up
    PoE Info: Adding new 54V capacity of 740000 mW, total capacity is 740000, total free capacity is 740000
    PoE Info: PoE module 1 of Unit 1 on ports 1/1/1 to 1/1/48 detected. Initializing....
    PoE Event Trace Log Buffer for 2000 log entries allocated
    PoE Event Trace Logging enabled...
    PoE Info: PoE module 1 of Unit 1 initialization is done.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/25. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/26. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/27. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/28. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/29. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/30. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/31. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/32. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/33. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/34. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/35. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/36. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/37. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/38. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/39. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/40. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/41. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/42. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/43. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/44. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/45. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/46. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/47. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Failed power allocation of 30000 mwatts on port 1/1/48. Will retry when more power budget.
    PoE: Power enabled on port 1/1/21.
    PoE: Power enabled on port 1/1/5.
    PoE: Power enabled on port 1/1/44.
    PoE: Power enabled on port 1/1/42.
    PoE: Power enabled on port 1/1/36.
    PoE: Power enabled on port 1/1/40.
    PoE: Power enabled on port 1/1/38.
     
    #2379
  20. klui

    klui Member

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    A long time ago I replaced the fans of an Extreme switch with these Noctuas. Fast forward maybe 2-3 years later, the switch starting failing due to bulging caps. I'm not sure if it was due to decreased airflow or what but I'm not as gung-ho in replacing fans anymore. In that same environment, I ran a Nortel 5520 without any issues on the stock fans. Louder for sure but ambient is in the upper 80s-low 90s during the summer. I'm probably not going to deploy the ICX6610 or EX4200 anytime soon since the S2500 works just as well for my current needs and the S2500 is noticeably quieter than the 5520.

    On the other hand, I replaced the fan of a Digi CM 32 and it's been working great for close to a decade.
     
    #2380
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