Updating firmware on different OEM HGST SAS hard disks?

Discussion in 'Hard Drives and Solid State Drives' started by frogtech, Jan 9, 2018.

  1. frogtech

    frogtech Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2016
    Messages:
    1,191
    Likes Received:
    127
    As long as I have a SAS disk formatted for the correct byte sector in the environment I'm using it in is it possible to take any general HGST SAS disk, say, HUC106060CSS600, that has an HP, IBM, or another OEM's part number on it, and update it with a firmware package say from Dell for that model? Anyone have experience or trouble doing this?
     
    #1
  2. Evan

    Evan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2016
    Messages:
    2,845
    Likes Received:
    424
    What I try to do I buy only the branded SSD that I have access to the hardware to do a ‘final’ update before using it on other systems. I would love to know not just for hgst but especially Samsung how to update otherwise but it’s seeming to prove next to impossible.

    Sg_write_buffer may be able to do it, see a few thread around here on the topic.
    Eg. https://forums.servethehome.com/ind...terprise-ssds-sm1625-pm853t-and-others.14014/
     
    #2
  3. frogtech

    frogtech Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2016
    Messages:
    1,191
    Likes Received:
    127
    Well, Dell has executable files for all the different HGST models out there, like the HUC109060CSS600, but I would be curious to know if they can even update drives from other vendors. I wonder if the firmware is agnostic or if it can at least recognize the device and just over-write the firmware. That would be ideal. I'm looking at some NetApp drives (they would have to be formatted to 512 byte block I'm sure) and also some drives that look like IBM pulls.
     
    #3
  4. frogtech

    frogtech Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2016
    Messages:
    1,191
    Likes Received:
    127
    Bump, still looking for an answer or more thoughts on this.

    Also, are these kinds of drives typically loaded with firmware that, when formatted back to 512 bytes for say use with a traditional raid or storage controller, would prevent them from operating optimally in standard RAID configurations?
     
    #4
  5. rootgremlin

    rootgremlin New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2016
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    4
    the fact thad a sas-disk does not have the standard 512b sector size is not an indicator id will not work on standard hardware. As all SAS enteprise Hard-disks i have seen so far could be (re)formatted to 512, 520 or 528 byte sector size. I have even seen newer spec sheets of sas disk with physical 4k sectors thad could be (re)formated to 4096, 4104 or 4112 secotr size.

    I would think most of the time the sector size is the only difference for this kind of Hard Drives. I do not believe HP, Dell Netapp and so on really do write their own disk-firmware.
    Why would they? they are bying millions of drives from the manufacturer and would just ordem them with the needed specs.
    And why would the manufacturer of the disk make different firmware versions. After all, every firmware has to do its basic task of storing data. And the user of a single disk would not see any change in behaviour with another drive-firmware (as far as i would think)
     
    #5
  6. frogtech

    frogtech Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2016
    Messages:
    1,191
    Likes Received:
    127
    Yeah that makes sense to me but I still think there must be minute differences.

    I got some HUC106060CSS600 disks (600gb) that were EMC pulls, I formatted them to 512 byte no problem and they work in my SAS enclosure, but I can't update them with Dell's firmware they released for that model.

    Now that I think about it, I wonder if the differences are only in the PCB and not in the firmware. Some kind of PCB h/w identifier maybe?
     
    #6
  7. i386

    i386 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2016
    Messages:
    1,665
    Likes Received:
    400
    @rootgremlin
    I think hp, dell and others get (firmware) sdks + a base firmware were they add the features (enryption, better checksums algorithms) they need.
    >After all, every firmware has to do its basic task of storing data.
    The firmware is the "os" for the controller in the ssd. It defines how the controller writes data to the nand (important for wear level), communicates over an interface like nvme (or sas, sata) with the host system, what algorithms are used for encryption, compressing, optimizing io queue or ecc and a lot of other things.
    >Why would they?
    For features that give them an advantage on the market ;D
     
    #7
  8. rootgremlin

    rootgremlin New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2016
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    4
    @frogtech
    how exactly did you try to upate the EMC Disks with the DELL Firmware?
    Every firmwareupdate i have come across did some kind of check and would not let you run itself against the "wrong" Hardware. Most of the time the updater looks for "Bios-Strings" or hardware-specific parts it could read to securely identify that it indeed only updates the Disks it was meant to update.

    I would not know any generic tool that lets you read or write firmware-parts of harddrives.
    AFAIK every disk has parts of its firmware on flash on the pcb, on a few specific (every disk another) sectors or a mix of both.

    @i386
    As we are talking about HARD DISKs, not SSDs in this thread, there is nothing special about the disk. The controller is just the manager of specific hardwareparts. The DISK-Controller does not really do any work. It is neither controlling the RPM nor taking part in the de/encryption nor does it the heavy lifting on the interface-side. He "only" does managment like turning on the circuit that conrolls the spindle motor, handing the crypto-hardware the keys or doing monitoring for the smart-values.

    HP, DELL, Netapp and so on, are bying standard parts and adding value by their package and by covering that that parts perfectly work together.
    Their value comes from the package they bundle, and the software they deliver for that packeage. The Disk is just another standard-part.
    It is like you are saying something in the lines of: they make their own CPU RAM Chipset to "add the features they need"
    They are big enough to ORDER the parts with the SPECS they need.

    Look at Netapp. Their Value is their WAFL filesystem in a time where noone else had a copy on write filesystem. So nothing disk-specific their.
     
    #8
  9. frogtech

    frogtech Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2016
    Messages:
    1,191
    Likes Received:
    127
    @rootgremlin

    I tried two methods, and didn't dive much further.

    1. Used Dell's fw exe package in windows with the drives attached to a passthrough controller
    2. Loaded Dell's nautilus disk utility on a bootable USB and launched it, it said no updates were available / necessary but the drives were visible.
     
    #9
Similar Threads: Updating firmware
Forum Title Date
Hard Drives and Solid State Drives Updating Rebranded Oracle P4608 firmware to Intel firmware? Nov 2, 2019
Hard Drives and Solid State Drives Updating firmware for HPE-rebranded Seagate XF1440 without a Linux Live CD Aug 30, 2019
Hard Drives and Solid State Drives Success updating Firmware on SEAGATE ST4000NM0023? Nov 1, 2018
Hard Drives and Solid State Drives Updating the HGST HDD & SSD firmware Nov 1, 2018
Hard Drives and Solid State Drives Updating HP Variant DC S3700 firmware to Intel OEM Dec 22, 2014

Share This Page