Lenovo ThinkCentre M75q Tiny Gen2 35W AMD Ryzen 5000 Powerhouse

EasyRhino

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would this be a platform that would maybe support unbuffered ECC ram? I know the ryzen's can, but don't know if Lenovo enabled it.
 

bryan_v

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@WANg quick question since you knew about the BAR limitation in V1500 series: do you know if this R5000 supports reBAR, and hence VF NICs from the X710? (and probably also >7 VFs with the CX3/CX5)

I did a quick scan of the tech sheet and product spect for the Ryzen Pro 5000 series and couldn't find anything
 

WANg

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@WANg quick question since you knew about the BAR limitation in V1500 series: do you know if this R5000 supports reBAR, and hence VF NICs from the X710? (and probably also >7 VFs with the CX3/CX5)

I did a quick scan of the tech sheet and product spect for the Ryzen Pro 5000 series and couldn't find anything
Depends on the BIOS support - the hardware can do it, but it depends on the AGESA firmware variant included.
 
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ReturnedSword

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Disappointing it doesn’t have a PCIe slot available. AFAIK, the Ryzen 4000 series M75q gen2 also didn’t have a PCIe a lot. Would be interesting to see what HP has.
 

bryan_v

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Ok so that's what I forgot to ask last time, is there a way to find out which AGESA FW is rolled into the BIOS?

Also Whoah!!! @ReturnedSword thanks for pointing that out, I didn't even notice that in the pictures. Without a PCIe slot, the whole 10G/25G NIC and VFs discussion is pretty moot. So sad that all that horse power is locked behind a sad Realtek 1G NIC. By comparison my 2 year-old i5-8700T M720q can do more with it's handicaped X710.

@Patrick I just flipped through the new Alder Lake Elite Desk article like you said and it sounds like it's handicapped by the same problem, no PCIe slot and no 10G. I assume you didn't order the Nvidia 3050 Ti version since it looks like it'll either be soldered or a proprietary AIC.
Alder Lake Lenovo Tiny might be our last hope for either native 10G or support for a 10G PCIe NIC putting it in the same weight class as the 10G Mac Mini.
 

ReturnedSword

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@bryan_v The HP EliteDesk 805 G8 (and possibly G6) has a PCIe slot since in normal supply chain times, it can support a dGPU (a dGPU, presumably a GTX 1660 Ti, isn’t available for configuration as of the last time I checked). I’m not sure about the PCIe lane config on it though. I couldn’t find any relevant info in the technical support manual. But I would assume it supports at least PCIe x8 which should be sufficient for a fiber card. Then the bracket would likely need to be a custom 3D printed bracket.
 
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bryan_v

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@ReturnedSword Sorry I meant the Elite Mini article that Cliff posted on the main site on the 24th. The 3050 Ti that is feeding the extra DP ports seems to be a proprietary connector and not a standard PCIe card.

I just saw a teardown of the HP EliteDesk 805 G6 Mini Desktop Review (AMD Ryzen 7 PRO) and it looks like it too has two M.2s but no PCIe :( (
)

Also because I thought I was going crazy, I double checked the service manual for the HP EliteDesk 805 G8 while eating breakfast, and the little cartoon they drew of the GPU card doesn't have a normal PCIe connector. (Can't find any realworld pictures or video of the internals of the G8)

Did you mean the HP EliteDesk 805 G8 SFF has a PCIe slot?
 

fossxplorer

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Thanks for the article. This one is hard to get in my country.

I wonder when HP will use a new AMD chip in their future t750 and t650? Zen3 based Ryzen Embedded would be nice, probably not even announced! If we can do 8C/16T at ~35W it would be really cool.
 

Patrick

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The 805 G6 has a proprietary PCIe connector.

Also, it uses the Flex IO v2. In theory, you can also get a 2.5GbE port for it. The downside is that it is not compatible with Flex IO (v1) so it is hard to find.

I have the 805 G8 with the 1660 Ti and 2.5GbE on order. Allegedly it gets built on 2/1.
 

ReturnedSword

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@ReturnedSword Sorry I meant the Elite Mini article that Cliff posted on the main site on the 24th. The 3050 Ti that is feeding the extra DP ports seems to be a proprietary connector and not a standard PCIe card.

I just saw a teardown of the HP EliteDesk 805 G6 Mini Desktop Review (AMD Ryzen 7 PRO) and it looks like it too has two M.2s but no PCIe :( (
)

Also because I thought I was going crazy, I double checked the service manual for the HP EliteDesk 805 G8 while eating breakfast, and the little cartoon they drew of the GPU card doesn't have a normal PCIe connector. (Can't find any realworld pictures or video of the internals of the G8)

Did you mean the HP EliteDesk 805 G8 SFF has a PCIe slot?
I’m expecting the EliteDesk 805 G8 Mini at the very least (and possibly G6 also) to have a dGPU option, which would need some kind of PCIe slot.

The additional ports, such as the DP you mentioned, would be Flex IO, which is proprietary :(

Thank you @Patrick for confirming the PCIe slot is proprietary. It’s a big shame. But at the same time, the slotted bracket space on the back of the unit appears to be smaller than standard HHHL cards anyway. If I do end up picking up one of these HP Minis, I probably won’t go for a dGPU one. Might as well wait for “next gen” since the 805 G6/8 Mini series was actually soft “released” last July 2021 IIRC. The supply chain issues have been brutal.
 

WANg

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The 805 G6 has a proprietary PCIe connector.

Also, it uses the Flex IO v2. In theory, you can also get a 2.5GbE port for it. The downside is that it is not compatible with Flex IO (v1) so it is hard to find.

I have the 805 G8 with the 1660 Ti and 2.5GbE on order. Allegedly it gets built on 2/1.
Yeah, seems like HP enjoys putting in propietary connectors for their dGPU setups - the Z2 Mini G4 features an MXM based setup…who even uses MXM anymore?
 

WANg

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Ok so that's what I forgot to ask last time, is there a way to find out which AGESA FW is rolled into the BIOS?

Also Whoah!!! @ReturnedSword thanks for pointing that out, I didn't even notice that in the pictures. Without a PCIe slot, the whole 10G/25G NIC and VFs discussion is pretty moot. So sad that all that horse power is locked behind a sad Realtek 1G NIC. By comparison my 2 year-old i5-8700T M720q can do more with it's handicaped X710.

@Patrick I just flipped through the new Alder Lake Elite Desk article like you said and it sounds like it's handicapped by the same problem, no PCIe slot and no 10G. I assume you didn't order the Nvidia 3050 Ti version since it looks like it'll either be soldered or a proprietary AIC.
Alder Lake Lenovo Tiny might be our last hope for either native 10G or support for a 10G PCIe NIC putting it in the same weight class as the 10G Mac Mini.
How to check? CPU-Z, probably.
 
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WANg

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Thanks for the article. This one is hard to get in my country.

I wonder when HP will use a new AMD chip in their future t750 and t650? Zen3 based Ryzen Embedded would be nice, probably not even announced! If we can do 8C/16T at ~35W it would be really cool.
Don’t expect the tx50 thin clients until at least 2023/24. That being said, Dell Wyse is due for a 5070 refresh, and that might get the Ryzen V3000/R3000, whenever that releases…
 

bryan_v

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How to check? CPU-Z, probably.
LOL, so obvious! I don't know why that didn't occur to me! Props++

Also waiting for my SFP28 Melanox CX4, it should just barely fit into the M720q, and hoping it stays cool enough without a fan.

Looking at the Lenovo M75q I get a feeling the reason the mainboard doesn't have a PCIe slot is because there's no dGPU option for the AMD R4000/5000 models...

The strangest thing though is that it looks like the traces and through-holes are preset on the mainboard; so someone at Lenovo might have thought it was important enough to save the $1.5 and not attach the slot to the traces. I'm so tempted to order or salvage a PCIe slot from another Tiny unit and reattach it it to the through-holes just to try it out. (I'm less confident in my SMT skills, so the second M.2 is probably out of the question)
 

geoffct

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The 805 G6 has a proprietary PCIe connector.

Also, it uses the Flex IO v2. In theory, you can also get a 2.5GbE port for it. The downside is that it is not compatible with Flex IO (v1) so it is hard to find.

I have the 805 G8 with the 1660 Ti and 2.5GbE on order. Allegedly it gets built on 2/1.

Sorry to resurrect an old post, but I stumbled on to some news in the PSREF / Parts Catalog of Lenovo:

The M90Q Gen 3 specs are here:

The notable changes:
  • 12th Gen Intel, upto 12900T
  • DDR5 ram
  • GEN 4x8 PCIe slot
  • optional 2.5GBe RTL8125BGS in "Second FlexIO port"
  • (minor) 2nd front USB-A port
I'm not clear if the 2.5GBe is a simply a very short PCIe card that just fills the bottom punchout, or it uses the FlexIO riser / port inside. (Hopefully the latter and I'll try M75q-2 compatibility.)

Just seems like something of interest for those following TMM news.
 
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geoffct

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Sorry to resurrect an old post, but I stumbled on to some news in the PSREF / Parts Catalog of Lenovo:

The M90Q Gen 3 specs are here:

The notable changes:
  • 12th Gen Intel, upto 12900T
  • DDR5 ram
  • GEN 4x8 PCIe slot
  • optional 2.5GBe RTL8125BGS in "Second FlexIO port"
  • (minor) 2nd front USB-A port
I'm not clear if the 2.5GBe is a simply a very short PCIe card that just fills the bottom punchout, or it uses the FlexIO riser / port inside. (Hopefully the latter and I'll try M75q-2 compatibility.)

Just seems like something of interest for those following TMM news.
Also adding a bit more from the Part side:

There's a new part for the Gen3 that is listed as:
BLD Tiny8 BTB Type-C card 100W 5C50W00907 - No clue which way the 100W works.

BLD Tiny8 BTB LAN card 5C50W00908 is likely the 2.5GBe card. It is listed as a BTB and 5C50W# which differs from the i350 intel which is listed as a PCIe card and a general part number

Bitland MR Tunderbolt miniLP 5C50V94334 - Interesting by all means, but does it use the PCIe slot?

Sunix 4COM card for Tiny8 5C50W00898, a 4 serial port card? It could be of interest for people on the industrial side.

***

M75q-2 related items, I found a few part numbers of interest

There is a 4 port USB option for the Gen2 Lenovo Tiny machines:
5C50W00919 / 5C50W00895 / 5C50W00896 (I believe each number is a different supplier and Bitland -895 may be actively embargo'ed to the USA)

There is a 2 port USB option:
5C50W00918 / 5C50W00891

Finally for those who didn't get a thumbscrew with their tiny EDIT: (and can justify $17 ea, didn't check the price first):
01EF086 / 5S10U51599
 
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