[DEAD] WD reds 4/8TB $90/$200 via shucking - update, 8TB reds now $180, 4TB deal looks dead.

dragonme

Active Member
Apr 12, 2016
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The 256k model looks more like the new 10tb drive spec wise... as according to the WD website the wd80ezfx 8tb red is still only supposed to have 128k cache...

So are these new 'Bargain' Best Buy drives early batches of the new 10tb drives that come of the line with issues?....

If the Thai line is making the 10tb drive and china making the 8tb drives.... and again.. WD actually disqualifies these drives somehow for use in an actual NAS where they allow up to 8 due to vibration..or other issues.. could these drives then have the same mechanicals but being repurposed for single drive external enclosures by turning off features in firmware... I would be intested in seeing the exact weight ... down to the gram of these 2 drives to see if they are identical... ie .. is the china 8tb drive a 4 platter red and the 256k drive a 5 platter red (same as the 10tb) but had its storage space curtailed by firmware.

I doubt that WD changed the spec of its flagship NAS products doubling cache on the 8tb without changing the specs on its website.

https://www.wdc.com/content/dam/wdc/website/downloadable_assets/eng/spec_data_sheet/2879-800002.pdf
 

sparx

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Jul 16, 2015
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The new HGST 12 TB is an 8 platter design. The older 10TB are 7. Highest density is 1.5TB per platter. Less in older designs.
 

dragonme

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Apr 12, 2016
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@sparx

Sorry misspoke and stand corrected .. you are right the 8 is 6 platter and the 10 7 .... point is if there is a weight difference between the Thai drive and the china drive than indeed they are not the same mechanicals package...

And they could be the 10tb drives rebranded.. since again WD still advertised the EZFX as a 128k drive... and the 1otb drive as 256k
 

PnoT

Active Member
Mar 1, 2015
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I have 10 from china and 10 from Tailand and here are some differences.

Tailand:
-No "Model Family" in smartctl
-SATA v3.2
-Half-height sticker on the top
-Model WD80EFAX-68LHPN0
-256mb cache

Code:
[root@freenas] /mnt/storage/Data/Scripts# smartctl -i /dev/da14
smartctl 6.5 2016-05-07 r4318 [FreeBSD 10.3-STABLE amd64] (local build)
Copyright (C) 2002-16, Bruce Allen, Christian Franke, www.smartmontools.org

=== START OF INFORMATION SECTION ===
Device Model:     WDC WD80EFAX-68LHPN0
Serial Number:    7SGEJ8WC
LU WWN Device Id: 5 000cca 252c625f6
Firmware Version: 83.H0A83
User Capacity:    8,001,563,222,016 bytes [8.00 TB]
Sector Sizes:     512 bytes logical, 4096 bytes physical
Rotation Rate:    5400 rpm
Form Factor:      3.5 inches
Device is:        Not in smartctl database [for details use: -P showall]
ATA Version is:   ACS-2, ATA8-ACS T13/1699-D revision 4
SATA Version is:  SATA 3.2, 6.0 Gb/s (current: 6.0 Gb/s)
Local Time is:    Fri Jul 28 08:13:00 2017 CDT
SMART support is: Available - device has SMART capability.
SMART support is: Enabled
China:
- SATA v3.1
-Model WD80EFZX-68UW8N0
-Full length sticker that covers the entire top
-128mb cache


Code:
[root@freenas] /mnt/storage/Data/Scripts# smartctl -i /dev/da10
smartctl 6.5 2016-05-07 r4318 [FreeBSD 10.3-STABLE amd64] (local build)
Copyright (C) 2002-16, Bruce Allen, Christian Franke, www.smartmontools.org

=== START OF INFORMATION SECTION ===
Model Family:     Western Digital Red
Device Model:     WDC WD80EFZX-68UW8N0
Serial Number:    R6G65XLY
LU WWN Device Id: 5 000cca 263c2d075
Firmware Version: 83.H0A83
User Capacity:    8,001,563,222,016 bytes [8.00 TB]
Sector Sizes:     512 bytes logical, 4096 bytes physical
Rotation Rate:    5400 rpm
Form Factor:      3.5 inches
Device is:        In smartctl database [for details use: -P show]
ATA Version is:   ACS-2, ATA8-ACS T13/1699-D revision 4
SATA Version is:  SATA 3.1, 6.0 Gb/s (current: 6.0 Gb/s)
Local Time is:    Fri Jul 28 08:13:36 2017 CDT
SMART support is: Available - device has SMART capability.
SMART support is: Enabled
 
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dragonme

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Apr 12, 2016
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@PnoT

First off.... jumping baby Jesus.... 20 8TB drives... my wife would have me buried in a shallow hole in the backyard....


Second... after dumping what like 4grand on drives.. any chance you have enough left over cash to buy a cheap kitchen scale and can get weights for each?!!!
 

PnoT

Active Member
Mar 1, 2015
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@PnoT

First off.... jumping baby Jesus.... 20 8TB drives... my wife would have me buried in a shallow hole in the backyard....


Second... after dumping what like 4grand on drives.. any chance you have enough left over cash to buy a cheap kitchen scale and can get weights for each?!!!
I have a hot spare that can be weighed and it's from Tailand but it won't be until this afternoon that I can post the results up. The china drives are in my pool at the moment so maybe someone else can post up.
 

dragonme

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Apr 12, 2016
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@PnoT

Thanks .. since we dont know when or if someone with a china drive can participate .. post up whatever your scale can do... ounces, grams, pennyweight, grains, etc... so hopefully we can get some empiricals going

To me its engaging that the china drive.. with its identical 128k cache to a real 8tb RED has a model and a full sticker while the thia.. possibly with a 10tb mechanicals package has a half label and more neutered firmware since its not reporting the same info in smart...

Intriguing...

I dont think that these 8TBs look the same as the older WD80EZZX from 2016... they seem a bit different but I too dont want to pull down my server to pull a drive.
 

dragonme

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Apr 12, 2016
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another interesting fact.. WD spec sheets for the RED line specify the weights for the 10 and 8tb drives as the same (even though the 10tb has 1 addl platter) with the caveat that the weights are +/- 10%

10% is a big fudge factor unless you intentionlly intend to mix and match mechanicals packages...
 

dragonme

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Apr 12, 2016
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another interesting fact.. WD spec sheets for the RED line specify the weights for the 10 and 8tb drives as the same (even though the 10tb has 1 addl platter) with the caveat that the weights are +/- 10%

10% is a big fudge factor unless you intentionlly intend to mix and match mechanicals packages...
 

ClintSouthwood

New Member
Aug 19, 2015
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another interesting fact.. WD spec sheets for the RED line specify the weights for the 10 and 8tb drives as the same (even though the 10tb has 1 addl platter) with the caveat that the weights are +/- 10%

10% is a big fudge factor unless you intentionlly intend to mix and match mechanicals packages...
I think you may be on to something here. I wouldn't put it past WD to slap a 10TB drive inside. I wouldn't even discount the possibility that these are actually 10TB drives that passed spec. That begs the question - will someone be brave enough to attempt to crossflash one of these in the future?
 

dragonme

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Apr 12, 2016
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if you took the 10tb drive internals and kept it from using the inside tracks it certainly would increase r/w speeds for the 8tb thai drive.. which did perform better than my EZZX drives
 

keybored

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May 28, 2016
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The 256k model looks more like the new 10tb drive spec wise... as according to the WD website the wd80ezfx 8tb red is still only supposed to have 128k cache...

So are these new 'Bargain' Best Buy drives early batches of the new 10tb drives that come of the line with issues?....
...
The reasons can be but don't have to be nefarious. BestBuy ordered a bunch of these drives from WD and WD could have substituted parts from compatible models to fulfill the order and meet the dates. They have full control of the BOM; they just have to ensure the final product meets the spec. Cost-wise it's probably a negligible difference for them. We're only talking about a 128MB increase.
They did something similar when they put HGST 8TB helium drives in some of their earlier externals. Seagate was first to market with an 8TB drive and WD had nothing in that market segment. So, they chose to substitute a better drive and ensure they have an offering in that segment.
 

dragonme

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Apr 12, 2016
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@keybored

agreed that it does not HAVE to be nefarious.. but I worked in the corporate world and if you dont think that they try to play the consumer, increase bottom line at whatever cost, and wouldnt reuse or repurpose what comes off the line and doest meet spec or stands lets say a higher statistical probability of not making it to the end of a 5 year warantee so lets put it into a product that has a 2 year or 1 year...

what concerend me in the aerospace world was how the beancounters and lawyers at the behest of marketing and managment would flat out ignore engineerings decision on safety or the way to build a x . if they could save a buck. they would go to the lawyers and say. ok if it did fail would we make more money by saving on producton after paying out for lawsuits.. and if the answer was yes.. that part came out second grade...


when WD launched the first my books 8TB.. benches were great.. turned out they were re-labled HGST 7200 8tbHE enterprise drives... shortly thereafter quietly shifted to much cheaper EZZX red-ish type drives... so were they playing the typical tech game of using 'engineering samples and cherry picked hardware' to hype it and get good reviews and benchmarks.. probably.. but since they dont advertise WHAT actual drive or speed is in that my book its prbably just leagal enough to change it to whatever they want as long as the capacity and any other advertised specs were in place.. ethical .. not by a longshot.. legal .. yep..
 

PigLover

Moderator
Jan 26, 2011
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@dragonme: Is the glass half empty - or half full? I've had some direct dealing with the Asian manufacturers. It is still just speculation that they might be the 10TB internals, but IF the drives really are built on the same mechanics as the 10TB drives internally my guess would be a "single sku line" mentality is driving it. Its saves a lot (and I mean $many $many $millions) to set up one production line and then do your product segmentation in software vs setting up production lines for 2 separate physical SKUs. If the marginal cost of manufacturing the different procucts is relatively small then this difference in setup and operations costs easily make it worthwhile.

Yes - it is likely that these are early-run drives from the 10TB line, down-spec'd and discounted because they didn't fully trust the line. Yes - it is likely that they are statistically likely to fall short of a full 5 year warranty. But probably not by much - I doubt WD would risk their brand reputation for the "red" series for this. If they really thought they were "B" stock drives they would have used a white label and probably sold them through a third party.

Even with these caveats, you are getting them at enough of a discount that you can self warranty. Just buy spares.
 
Last edited:

dragonme

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Apr 12, 2016
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clearly yes.... all speculation obviously.. we have no concrete evidence on the hardware side and we will never know what WD's corporate decisions are... but...

2 drives with the same product wd80efzx right.. with 2 different cache levels? that makes no sense...none

WD did not change the specs of the 8tb red on thier data page.. its still a 128k drive...

so its curious that one product.. the 8tb easy store.. has 2 completely different hardware based drives in them, with essentially the same part numbers... and sticker with just the cache level changed?

the easystore seems to me to be a 'frankenstien' sku to dump in whatever un-needed or un-wanted... perhaps.. stock...

and yes. it would save money on mfg as I have said repeatedly above.. but in this case its comming off 2 different lines and they are making 2 different produces.. 128 and 256 and WD doesnt even have or advertise they have a 256k 8TB drive.. it doesnt exist...
 

dragonme

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Apr 12, 2016
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now if you want a really nefarious business model.. they decided to do this exactly because they are being highly schucked and with a red label on them (which I still dont really believe that TLER would be on for a drive in a single disk enclosure) but anyway..

they sell em knowing full well that the vast majority will never need to be waranteed the minute they left the enclosure..

i bet that whatever the hardware the firmware is likely much more like the ezzx white lable drives and have been neutered for NAS/Raid use
 

dragonme

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Apr 12, 2016
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@PigLover I could tell you but then guys in dark sunglasses would show up at your door and wipe your memory or you would have a clinton style accident...


I was happy to just jamb these into my ZFS and let them be happy but someone here.. not saying who ....disrespected the tommy Boy and just had to have citations... like some PhD has really done any research on the matter.. but here is another interesting chart I put together

Code:
        china 8 RED         thai 8TB RE        ezzx white        10tb RED    8TB 256 RED
   
MDL        wd80EFZX        WD80EFZX        WD80EZZX        WD100EFAX    WD80EFAX

PN        2W10102               2W10102               2W10100               2W10208        2W10209

RN        US7saJ800        WD7saj800        US7saj800        USSAL100    US7SAL080
   
5V        440ma                 440ma                440mA                400ma            400ma
so what are we looking at..

ok the china 8 and thia 8 are the same model number drives and the china drive is a lable pulled from a easy store

the ezzx while lable is what it is from a my book

the 10tb red is a label from a review

the 8tb 256 is the Thai version of the easystore in question

notice how all 3 8tb 'RED' and while labels have the same MDL# in the next to last position
notice how all 3 have a PN with the same 2W101 prefix
notice how all 3 have a RN of US7SAJ
notice the 5v 440mA rating

now look at the similarities of the 10tb and the 8TB bastard child... in the same areas... they look like cousins to me...

I think my chart pretty much nails it.. and these are off the drives labels
 
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