Bought a used HP z6 g4. Upgrade to w-3245 qs?

[JuanHanded]

First post, and a newbie. I just bought a used HP Workstation z6 g4 with xeon. For now I want to use it as a workstation for AutoCAD and 3D school work mostly. Later it may get some use as a server down the road.

It has a slow xeon in it, FCLGA 3647 socket and C622 chipset. Looking around, I see it should be able to swap in a w-3245 16 core processor
Intel® Xeon® W-3245 Processor (22M Cache, 3.20 GHz) - Product Specifications | Intel
with a pretty high clock speed.

Looking on eBay, I see that I can get this processor from a couple of Chinese sellers as a w-3245m qs for under $300. I don't know where to start as far looking at a Qs processor. I need to know what information I need to ask for or any info I can get from the seller to see if this is going to serve me well or just be a big problem. I am not in a huge hurry, I am able to do the work that I have now with the laptops I have, but would like to make this my main desktop if I can get everything together over a period of time. Please help. Thank you!

 

[nexox]

I don't really have much to offer regarding import QS CPUs, but depending on the specific model of the slow Xeon you have now an upgrade might be quite affordable.

 

[zachj]

I’ve seen reports of people running ES and QS processors in the Z6 but have no first hand experience with it. I am currently running an OEM Xeon gold 6268CL with no problems…

QS chips should be equivalent to retail chips and the w-3245 is on the official support list from HP so it very likely should work just fine.

 

[JuanHanded]

I’ve seen reports of people running ES and QS processors in the Z6 but have no first hand experience with it. I am currently running an OEM Xeon gold 6268CL with no problems…

QS chips should be equivalent to retail chips and the w-3245 is on the official support list from HP so it very likely should work just fine.

That is good news. However I am wondering if there are any tips for researching info that the seller may be able to provide, such as the labeling info. The ones I have looked at briefly were written in Chinese, however I'm sure I can decipher what the figures are attributed to.

I also wonder if I should quickly benchmark everything and see if the performance is what the processor is rated for. Not sure what recourse I will have with the seller if it is not? I see that there is a rather long Xeon QS Forum thread on here that I need to check out in more detail!!

 

[nexox]

What model Xeon do you currently have and what specifically seems slow? Plenty of first and second generation Scalable Xeons have low core counts and clocks, some don't even have turbo boost, but for $20-50 there are a few pretty solid options, especially for multi threaded workloads.

 

[JuanHanded]

It currently has a Xeon 5117. For my use currently I probably don't need 16 cores but actually a higher clock speed. The w-3245 is 3.2 and 4.6 turbo if I recall correctly. I think that is the highest clock speed of any processor that will work with this motherboard. But I imagine at some time soon they will figure out how to utilize these cores on a lot of this 3D and rendering programs. And also when this setup is made into a server it should work well. The specs on this processor are pretty impressive, especially at $300!

 

[nexox]

Yeah the 5117 isn't great, a $20 6132 gets you the same core count but somewhat higher clocks (2.6/3.7), and if 8 cores is enough then the W-2145 is only $100 for a production model from a US seller, 3.7GHz base and 4.5GHz turbo.

 

[mrpasc]

then the W-2145 is only $100 for a production model

But isn’t the W-2xxx FCLGA2066? If I understood correctly OP wants to swap a LGA3647 proc?

 

[nexox]

But isn’t the W-2xxx FCLGA2066? If I understood correctly OP wants to swap a LGA3647 proc?

Oh, yep, I totally forgot that the Xeon Ws used a different socket for that generation.

 

[JuanHanded]

Oh, yep, I totally forgot that the Xeon Ws used a different socket for that generation.

Yes that is correct, it is the LGA 3647 socket. At 4.60 GHz turbo, the W-3245 should do my work quite well. This is all provided that the QS from the Chinese Ebay seller performs like the regular production Xeon. I am going to go through the Xeon ES thread to see if I can get some ideas.

 

[cageek]

Yes that is correct, it is the LGA 3647 socket. At 4.60 GHz turbo, the W-3245 should do my work quite well. This is all provided that the QS from the Chinese Ebay seller performs like the regular production Xeon. I am going to go through the Xeon ES thread to see if I can get some ideas.

My opinions only...

If you're patient, you can sometimes get a W-3235 - non-QS, Mac Pro 2019 processor pulls - for $250 or less. I've read that AutoCAD doesn't really use multi-processor so much - so spend the $'s somewhere else (e.g. GPU). Check passmark for "Single Thread Rating".

Also, your Z6 probably came with 2666 Mhz DDR4, rather than 2933 Mhz DDR4 that the cascade lake processors max out with. Something to think about.

Cheaper options on Gen1 CPU for a workstation might be something like Xeon Gold 6136 (~$60) / 6146 (~$120).

 

[JuanHanded]

My opinions only...

If you're patient, you can sometimes get a W-3235 - non-QS, Mac Pro 2019 processor pulls - for $250 or less. I've read that AutoCAD doesn't really use multi-processor so much - so spend the $'s somewhere else (e.g. GPU). Check passmark for "Single Thread Rating".

Also, your Z6 probably came with 2666 Mhz DDR4, rather than 2933 Mhz DDR4 that the cascade lake processors max out with. Something to think about.

Cheaper options on Gen1 CPU for a workstation might be something like Xeon Gold 6136 (~$60) / 6146 (~$120).

Yes, currently Autocad does not utilize multi processor, but they have pushed their recommended specs at an accelerated pace lately and there other graphics programs starting to utilize it, so it is coming soon. Autodesk is a bloated snail of a corporation so I bet they get left behind soon. I am not at a skill level currently to be limited by having the most optimum processor available. But I think things will move to multicore softwares quickly. And yes GPU is the bottleneck, and the only solution to that one is to spend money.

And yes, upgrading the RAM is planned. The machine only has 32gb of 2666 Mhz DDR4, which is pretty much a minimum requirement at this point. And I am not super motivated to spend a bunch on it now, but will keep my eyes open and form my wicked plan!

 

[zachj]

I would suggest getting 64gb lrdimms; while you can find 16gb and 32gb dimms for less money, having only 6 dimm slots is a constraint if you ever want to have more than 96gb of ram—ideally you’ll buy memory modules that you don’t have to replace later simply because they’re too small.

i don’t know what the memory requirements are for your use case but I’m assuming you probably don’t need more than 256gb of ram (and probably even 128gb is overkill)—in that case you’ll care a lot more about having all six slots populated (in order to maximize bandwidth) than you will how big each module is.

 

[nexox]

For the price difference between 64GB DDR4 and 32GB I think a lot of people would be happy with 192GB total. I'd do that and drop in a 6132 and then see what it needs for storage, given the CPU and memory configuration I suspect it's got a kind of lame SSD, or even just a spinning disk.

 

[JuanHanded]

I would suggest getting 64gb lrdimms; while you can find 16gb and 32gb dimms for less money, having only 6 dimm slots is a constraint if you ever want to have more than 96gb of ram—ideally you’ll buy memory modules that you don’t have to replace later simply because they’re too small.

i don’t know what the memory requirements are for your use case but I’m assuming you probably don’t need more than 256gb of ram (and probably even 128gb is overkill)—in that case you’ll care a lot more about having all six slots populated (in order to maximize bandwidth) than you will how big each module is.

My plans for this machine is to use it as a workstation and eventually convert it to a server, whether that be for home use or small business for me. So ECC registered memory would probably be as smart way to go but I guess it comes down to how much I want to spend short-term versus long-term. At this point in time 64 GB of RAM will be plenty. I could probably get some cheap Ram to just occupy all the slots for now and then upgrade in the future or I could just get top of the line and keep adding to it as I go. It probably doesn't pay to spend a lot on much more than I need at this point, because as I'm sure everyone here knows, plans and circumstances change pretty frequently. But I do want to be smart about everything.

 

[JuanHanded]

For the price difference between 64GB DDR4 and 32GB I think a lot of people would be happy with 192GB total. I'd do that and drop in a 6132 and then see what it needs for storage, given the CPU and memory configuration I suspect it's got a kind of lame SSD, or even just a spinning disk.

The 6132 processor is probably a very good deal for this setup. However keep in mind that AutoCAD is recommending 3.0 gHz and up for these systems and I'm sure they are going to up that with new versions. I'm pretty sure that I'm not going to be approaching the need of that for a little while at least, so the 6132 would probably serve me well. However more gHz from the start wouldn't hurt, except for the wallet, let's just say I could find that w-3245 for $300 and it worked like a regular production model, I think I could pretty much set it and forget it and the processor selection part of this system would be over forever. Risky I know.

 

[nexox]

Assuming AutoCAD is mostly single-threaded then the 6132 will run that thread at 3.7GHz, and it's still 50% faster than what you've got, even though it's not as fast as possible.

 

[UhClem]

... And yes, upgrading the RAM is planned. The machine only has 32gb of 2666 Mhz DDR4 ...

You probably do NOT have the Memory Cooling Kit option, which HP says is "required" for >32GB configurations. [I don't know whether you get a hard-fail @ POST, or just a warning during.]

 

[JuanHanded]

You probably do NOT have the Memory Cooling Kit option, which HP says is "required" for >32GB configurations. [I don't know whether you get a hard-fail @ POST, or just a warning during.]

I have seen the large shroud/duct with fan that HP makes for this. I think you can find one for about $50. And without it, you do get a notice every time you boot, that you can skip. I saw a thread somewhere where someone monitored temps over a period of time and concluded that the stock memory cooler worked just fine. He even installed a jumper that stopped the warning message. I will search around when I get a chance and post a link.

 

[NachoCDN]

You probably do NOT have the Memory Cooling Kit option, which HP says is "required" for >32GB configurations. [I don't know whether you get a hard-fail @ POST, or just a warning during.]

i know for the z440 you get a warning which halts boot until you press a key