ATX motherboard for server?

Notice: Page may contain affiliate links for which we may earn a small commission through services like Amazon Affiliates or Skimlinks.
L

Leo Levosky

Member
May 17, 2017
42
1
8
I'm looking for an ATX server motherboard with onboard mini-SAS (at least I think that is what it is called). Need to support 9 hard disks.

Tried looking at Supermicro website but couldn't find an option to search for mini-SAS and I've no idea what the latest tech is i.e latest cpu, chipset etc.

Would like lower power consumption.

Will probably run TrueNAS so needs to support a reasonable amount of ECC ram as I will use at least 9x8TB disks (or bigger if the price is right)

10g networking would be a bonus as would remote management.

Not sure the correct term for this, but I have seen some server boards with pre-installed passive cpu. That would be quite nice if powwerful enough.

Any suggestions?
 
I

i386

Well-Known Member
Mar 18, 2016
4,245
1,546
113
34
Germany
Do you need "real" sas or just more ports? Sata or sas hdds?
What's "reasonable ammount" of ram for you?
10GB rj45 or sfp+?
I think you mean the soc (system on a chip) boards, there are a bunch with different options for different use cases...
 
Z

zack$

Well-Known Member
Aug 16, 2018
715
347
63
Try the X10SRH-CF with a cheap 10G card + e5-2680 V4.

A bunch of us got this MB in the great deals section sometime ago and it's still a viable option for a NAS.

I just checked the link and the same seller has a bunch more (try the OBO for around $120-160 or maybe even better):
www.ebay.com

Supermicro X10SRH-CF Single Socket LGA2011 Motherboard | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Supermicro X10SRH-CF Single Socket LGA2011 Motherboard at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!
www.ebay.com
 
R

RTM

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2014
956
359
63
It is probably worth mentioning that there is more information in this thread:

We need more information to give you good suggestions.
What kind of budget do you have for this? (Motherboard + RAM and CPU if not included on the motherboard)
Are you looking to buy new or used?

Is there a specific reason why you need the mini-sas ports to be on the motherboard, or can it be with a separate controller card? (a separate card may be cheaper)

What kind of disks do you intend to buy?
If you are planning to buy SATA disks, you don't absolutely need to buy a board with a SAS controller or a separate controller.
 
R

RTM

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2014
956
359
63
You (OP) mentioned in the other thread, that you are from the UK.

As such, you could buy this server to get the motherboard + RAM:
www.ebay.com

ASROCK 1U Server D1541D4U Intel D-1541 CPU @ 2.1GHz 64GB RAM 2x 10GBe IPMI 2x1TB | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for ASROCK 1U Server D1541D4U Intel D-1541 CPU @ 2.1GHz 64GB RAM 2x 10GBe IPMI 2x1TB at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!
www.ebay.com

It includes an 8 core Xeon d-1541 SoC and an 8 port SAS3008 controller.
I would try to see if you can get it for around 300 GBP.

The main downsides to this board, is the age of the SoC (should still be MUCH better than a N54L), the noise from the heatsink (it is a bit loud).

Alternatively they also have a server with a board that has a Xeon d-2143it SoC:
www.ebay.com

ASROCK 1U Server S4P2143 Intel D-2143IT 8 Core CPU 2.20GHz 64GB 2x 10GB SAN M.2 | eBay

PCIe x 16 - SLOT6: PCIe3.0 x16; auto switch to x8 when SLOT4 is occupied. RJ45 - 1 x RJ45 Dedicated IPMI LAN port. USB 3.2 Gen1 Port - 2 Type-A (USB3.2 Gen1). Hard Drives.
www.ebay.com

Downsides to this board is that the SAS HD ports is AFAIK not from a SAS controller (potential problem if you need that), and absolutely no BIOS/IPMI updates. Heatsink may also be an issue, since it requires a separate fan (which may be a good thing).

For what it is worth I have both of these boards, if you are interested you can also find more information about these on the forum :)
 
  • Like
Reactions: numanumani
L

Leo Levosky

Member
May 17, 2017
42
1
8
i386 said:
Do you need "real" sas or just more ports? Sata or sas hdds?
What's "reasonable ammount" of ram for you?
10GB rj45 or sfp+?
I think you mean the soc (system on a chip) boards, there are a bunch with different options for different use cases...
Click to expand...
I'm afraid I don't understand the difference between Sata and SAS. I have an HP N54L microserver and it has one connection on the motherboard. I thought that was mini-SAS? I tried searching for an article explaining it but failed to find anything. I just would like to minimise cabling.

With regard to memory I understand that TrueNAS wants a lot of memory based on the amount of disk space. I'd like a large amount of disk space as I want to rip all my bluray disks. At the moment I have 5x4tb and I'm almost out of disk space and I've not ripped any blurays. I want to store recorded TV shows too.

With regard to 10G networking, I don't currently have a 10g switch so I'd love advice.
 
L

Leo Levosky

Member
May 17, 2017
42
1
8
RTM said:
We need more information to give you good suggestions.
What kind of budget do you have for this? (Motherboard + RAM and CPU if not included on the motherboard)
Are you looking to buy new or used?

Is there a specific reason why you need the mini-sas ports to be on the motherboard, or can it be with a separate controller card? (a separate card may be cheaper)

What kind of disks do you intend to buy?
If you are planning to buy SATA disks, you don't absolutely need to buy a board with a SAS controller or a separate controller.
Click to expand...
I've answered some of the questions above.

With regard to budget I don't have anything in mind. I'm more interested in what the options are. At the moment I just know I'm going to run out of disk space soon. As I'm in the UK options are limited. When I look at the US there are loads of options for both new and used kit but I don't find the same here.

The only absolute is that I don't have the physical space for a rack mount solution (homes in the UK are small!!) and I want low noise for similar reasons.

At the moment the N54L is just for data (mainly media files) and I have a satellite TV card in my main PC. This is proving a pain. Ideally I would like the main storage and TV recording in the same server. But that is not an absolute. I just don't want it in my main PC.

For disk I've been looking at larger capacity WD as I've been using Red Plus drives for quite a while, but I'm open to suggestions.

As I've never ripped a bluray I've no idea of capacity I need but I don't want to run out of storage again for a while. I guess I will also buy 4k blurays when they become cheaper too although ripping them seems more complex.
 
R

RTM

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2014
956
359
63
Regarding SAS/SATA, here are some of the basics (I am ignoring stuff like SAS expanders, oculink and other new connectors)

Connectors:
  • mini SAS aka SFF-8087, a single connector can be used to connect to 4 drives (fanout to individual drives via backplane or special 1 to 4 cable)
    • Commonly but not exclusively used with SAS2 (6Gbps) and older hardware (like the N54L series microserver)
  • mini SAS HD, aka SFF-8643, like mini SAS a single connector can connect to 4 drives
    • Commonly used with SAS3 (12Gbps) hardware
    • In my opinion a much nicer connector to work with
SATA disks can connect to SAS-cables/connectors (like you see in the microserver)

Common types of cables:
  • mini SAS (HD) to mini SAS (HD)
    • Commonly used to connect a controller to a backplane
  • mini SAS (HD) to 4x SATA/SAS forward cable
    • Commonly used to connect a controller to individual drives directly or a backplane that does not use a SFF-8087 or SFF-8643 port.
  • 4x SATA to mini SAS (HD), reverse cable
    • Commonly used to connect SATA ports on a motherboard to a backplane that uses a SFF-8087 or SFF-8643 port
Controller need to knows:
  • You can connect a SATA drive to a SAS controller but not the other way around
  • (at least theoretically) Both SAS2 and SAS3 can achieve maximum bandwidth with SATA disks
    • But as most SAS2 controllers are rather old now, there may be other benefits to using a SAS3 controller
Other things worth mentioning:
  • When using ZFS, you want to use either a HBA (Host Bus Adapter) or the ports from the motherboard (in AHCI mode)
    • Many SAS RAID controllers can be changed into a HBA with a different firmware (LSI/Broadcom/Avago) or a change in the configuration (Like the HP H240) (but not all, so search through the forum for details, if you need to do this)
  • Since you plan to use TrueNAS, which is based on FreeBSD (for now anyway), you may find that it has less support for hardware (you may have issues with the Satelite TV card, the HP H240 controller I mentioned before is not supported).
 
R

RTM

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2014
956
359
63
A few other comments, that don't really deal much with SAS:
  • If you have issues with the TV card, you may want to consider setting up a VM for it and passthrough the card to the VM (that way if TrueNAS does not support the card, it might still be usable).
    • You will need to figure out the best way to transfer the recorded data though.
  • You mention 9x8TB disks, and that you are worried about running out of storage, as such, unless you have a specific reason for wanting 9 disks (such as redundancy) I suggest you get larger but fewer disks.
  • If you don't need SAS drives and don't need more than 10 disks, you can probably find a motherboard that like Supermicro X10SRI-F that has 10 SATA ports, that way you won't need a SAS controller (which does use more power).
Personally, if I were to buy from new, I would probably get the X570D4U motherboard from Asrock Rack, add a Ryzen 7 CPU (8 cores) and around 64GB of RAM (ideally via 2x 32GB sticks). The board only supports up to 8 SATA ports (may be enough if you use bigger disks), but you can add an extra controller.
 
L

Leo Levosky

Member
May 17, 2017
42
1
8
Thanks for all the info.

I have an old Asus motherboard with an Intel 2500k cpu. The motherboard doesn't have enough Sata ports but I wonder if it is worth getting a PCIe card to expand the number of ports and use Ubuntu server. The logic being I can experiment and see what works okay. The satellite tv card company says their cards don't work with a VM but I never got a sensible explanation as to why not. I couldn't use a VM for the TV card with a 2500k but I assume I wouldn't need to if I use Ubuntu.

Your explanation of SAS was most useful. My only reason for looking for a mini-SAS solution was to reduce the cabling as I liked how small the cable is on the N54L. I've never seen small Sata cables. Even the flat ones take up quite a lot of space and my current cases don't cater for cable routing very well. If I buy a new motherboard I'd prefer a compact connector.

Do you think that is a good idea and, if so, can you recommend a suitable card?

I have a lot to learn with TVheadend, Jellyfin etc. but if all works okay I can look at getting a new motherboard later if required.

Can I still use ZFS on Ubuntu and should I? ZFS was my main selling point on TrueNAS and it has been wonderfullly stable etc.
 
R

RTM

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2014
956
359
63
There are many "moving parts" in this equation (case, motherboard/CPU, OS and a TV tuner) I think it is a good idea to do an iteration using parts you have lying around already before you spend real money (buying a cheap SAS controller should be doable on a small budget - but of course you may want to buy something better than just whatever is the cheapest).

If you want less cable mess (which is understandable), I strongly suggest not buying splitter (1 to 4) cables intended to connect directly to SAS disks (via SFF-8482 connectors on the drive side). Like this one. Something like this cable is better, but will not work with SAS drives (unless power is provided by a backplane, and backplane accepts "SATA-style" connectors).
Personally I strongly recommend getting something with a backplane and ideally one that just takes one or two SFF8087 or SFF8643 connectors), as I find that routing cables from the PSU can be a pain.

Ubuntu will supports ZFS, though you will probably find that it is more work to configure it.
You may want to consider using TrueNAS Scale which is based on Linux, Proxmox could also be an alternative.

Regarding controller there are many options, but if you want something that is a relatively safe bet but also relatively cheap, I would look at something like Fujitsu's CP400i, which can be crossflashed to official (meaning from LSI/Broadcom/Avago - the controller vendor) IT mode (meaning it will function as a HBA) 9300-8i (equivalent model sold by LSI/Broadcom/Avago) firmware.
Here is an example:
www.ebay.com

Fujitsu PRAID Cp400i SAS 12g SATA 6g Pcieraid Card A3C40176030 D3327-a12 for sale online | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Fujitsu PRAID Cp400i SAS 12g SATA 6g Pcieraid Card A3C40176030 D3327-a12 at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!
www.ebay.com
@Sleyk has written a tutorial on how to do the crossflashing here:

Of course as with everything involving spending money, I suggest you spend some time investigating things (such as by reading forum threads) to get a feel for things, because at the end of the day there are no guarantees:cool:
 
L

Leo Levosky

Member
May 17, 2017
42
1
8
Thank you for your comprehensive reply. I've been doing a lot of reading and my brain hurts!!!!

TrueNAS Scale seems like the best option as Jellyfin and TVheadend are both available at TrueCharts.

From all the reading I have done there is just one thing I can't work out. Do Apps on TrueNAS Scale rely on virtualisation? The Intel 2500k doesn't support VT-d so I won't be able to use the system I have with things like Proxmox and access the TV card. Will it work with TrueNAS Scale and access the TV card direcctly?
 
R

RTM

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2014
956
359
63
I can't say for sure, my hunch is that it is not virtualization.

But given you have the hardware already, you could just try it out? (of course report back your findings, so it may help someone in the future)
 
zer0sum

zer0sum

Well-Known Member
Mar 8, 2013
850
475
63
Leo Levosky said:
Thank you for your comprehensive reply. I've been doing a lot of reading and my brain hurts!!!!

TrueNAS Scale seems like the best option as Jellyfin and TVheadend are both available at TrueCharts.

From all the reading I have done there is just one thing I can't work out. Do Apps on TrueNAS Scale rely on virtualisation? The Intel 2500k doesn't support VT-d so I won't be able to use the system I have with things like Proxmox and access the TV card. Will it work with TrueNAS Scale and access the TV card direcctly?
Click to expand...
I'd also throw UNraid into the mix to see if that fits your needs better.
I found it to be a far better fit for me as a home nas/server with all of my docker containers running on it :D
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom