Minisfourm MS-01 Nvidia RTX A4000 PCIe Installation

[LDighera]

Minisfourm MS-01 Nvidia RTX A4000 PCIe Installation​

No additional power is required to operate the Nvidia RTX A4000SSF GPU in the MS-01. I'm in the midst of configuring ...

Below are some of the documents to guide others who may want to go down this road::

Nvidia RTX A400SFF Data Sheet





Power requirement for the Nvidia RTX A4000 (no SFF suffix) is 140 Watts.




PCIe 3.0 16X Extension Cable 180 Degree PCIe 16X to 16X Flexible Riser Card
Nvidia Linux RTX A4000 Driver Downloads

(Please indulge my nubee use of the posting composition editor.)

More as time permits.

Larry

 

[wadup]

You will def need a 240w power adapter for that card. This one worked for me (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CQYL186K?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details)

This guy is about to release single slot cooler:

Nvidia RTX 4000 SFF Ada single slot cooler | n3rdware

With this custom full copper cooler, you can use your RTX 4000 SFF Ada in extremely small cases that only allow low-profile, single slot PCIe cards.

n3rdware.com

Here is how you can get a4000 in the MS-01 without a riser:

https://forums.servethehome.com/index.php?threads/minisforum-ms-01-pcie-card-and-ram-compatibility-thread.42785/post-412802

 

[LDighera]

Thank you very much for the information you have so kindly provided.

You will def need a 240w power adapter for that card. This one worked for me (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CQYL186K?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details)

The Nvidia RTX A4000SFF is running without a problem so far. From the data sheet, it only requires 70 Watts. I searched for compatible power cables for it, but failed to find anything including on the Nvidia site. What makes you believe that additional power will be required?

This guy is about to release single slot cooler:

Nvidia RTX 4000 SFF Ada single slot cooler | n3rdware

With this custom full copper cooler, you can use your RTX 4000 SFF Ada in extremely small cases that only allow low-profile, single slot PCIe cards.

n3rdware.com

Here is how you can get a4000 in the MS-01 without a riser:

https://forums.servethehome.com/index.php?threads/minisforum-ms-01-pcie-card-and-ram-compatibility-thread.42785/post-412802

Thank you again. Of course, I'd prefer the GPU to be within the case. I subscribed to Robbe's newsletter, so that I will be notified when his custom-built Nvidia RTX A4000SFF cooler will be available to purchase.

Larry

 

[LDighera]

I'm sorry to report that I am having difficulty installing the Nvidia RTX A4000SFF driver on my Debian 12 Bookworm system.

First, I installed the driver from the Debian repository, but it failed to produce video. So, I attempted to install the driver from the Nvidia link in my previous post. That produced an error, and subsequent screen resolution was very low (something like 600 X 800), but at least I still have access to the system. I then attempted to uninstall the driver(s), and fear I've munged my apt system beyond repair. (Any assistance on how to restore the apt system to its original functionality is appreciated. I'm considering installing another instance of Debian 12 on one of the NVMe SSDs, and proceeding afresh.)

Subsequently, I found these documents: Advice For New Users On Not Breaking Their Debian System and how to install the NVIDIA proprietary display driver on Debian systems. I'm hoping they will enable me to repair the damage and begin to use the Nvidia RTX A400SFF to its full potential.

Everything appears fully functional under Windows 11 64-bit.

Temperatures appear within bounds so far.

Larry

 

[wadup]

What makes you believe that additional power will be required?

You always want to leave yourself room for potential max power situations. When it comes to power always plan for the worst case scenario. The 13900H max is 115W and the a4000 max is 70W which is 185W and the MS-01 power adapter is 180W. While you may never run into a situation and everything works fine there could be throttling going on that you don't even realize. If you do run out of power a whole slew of things could happen and none of them good. 240W power adapter is cheap give yourself some room and enjoy the hardware without fear of pushing it.

 

[LDighera]

You always want to leave yourself room for potential max power situations. When it comes to power always plan for the worst case scenario. The 13900H max is 115W and the a4000 max is 70W which is 185W and the MS-01 power adapter is 180W. While you may never run into a situation and everything works fine there could be throttling going on that you don't even realize. If you do run out of power a whole slew of things could happen and none of them good. 240W power adapter is cheap give yourself some room and enjoy the hardware without fear of pushing it.

That seems sound reasoning.

So the
GaN Charger for Laptop, DC 20V and Two USB C PD3.0 100W : 240W,230W,200W,180W,170W - Gaming Laptop AC Adapter simply replaces the Minisforum PS, and plugs into the MS-01 rear barrel jack. No Nvidia GPU power cable required. Cool!

Without the larger PS, the system with GPU is ~42 mA (5 Watts) underpowered. For the time being, I'll use the factory PS, and monitor temps to see how it goes.

Thanks again for the support.

Larry

 

[bobbysteel]

With an a2000 at least can confirm that powersupply works great

 

[LDighera]

With an a2000 at least can confirm that powersupply works great

You are referring to the Nvidia RTX A2000SFF, correct? The non-SFF adapters require twice as much power as the SFF adapters, I believe.

 

[wadup]

So by default your cpu power limits are:



When you install a GPU it changes to this:



The CPU is running with lower power when a GPU is installed. All throughout the release, youtube, and I emailed them they said any use of a desktop GPU needs a 240w power adapter unless your powering it with external psu (4060 OC Low Profile). The a2000 they have been recommending is the mobile version and I am not sure of the difference between it and the desktop version.

If you really want to know change the power levels back to 60000 and 80000 with a GPU installed and stress test the GPU. My guess its going to throttle the whole system, crash, restart etc.

 

[bobbysteel]

You are referring to the Nvidia RTX A2000SFF, correct? The non-SFF adapters require twice as much power as the SFF adapters, I believe.

yes correct

 

[LDighera]

So by default your cpu power limits are:

View attachment 34922

When you install a GPU it changes to this:

View attachment 34923

The CPU is running with lower power when a GPU is installed. All throughout the release, youtube, and I emailed them they said any use of a desktop GPU needs a 240w power adapter unless your powering it with external psu (4060 OC Low Profile). The a2000 they have been recommending is the mobile version and I am not sure of the difference between it and the desktop version.

If you really want to know change the power levels back to 60000 and 80000 with a GPU installed and stress test the GPU. My guess its going to throttle the whole system, crash, restart etc.

Thank you once again for your valuable input.

The Nvidia RTX A4000 (desktop version) specifies 140 Watt maximum power consumption. The Nvidia RTX A4000SFF (mobile version) spec. is: 70 Watts.

It is interesting that the BIOS Power Limit settings automatically change when the GPU is installed in the PCIe slot. So far, with the GPU installed, I haven't seen system total power consumption exceed 100 Watts, but I hadn't changed the BIOS Advanced/Power Limit 1 or Power Limit 2 settings from 45000 and 60000 respectively. I'll set them back to 60000 and 80000 and monitor power consumption.

I only recently managed to get the Nvidia-driver (525.147.05) installed. This was a bit complex task with Debian Bookworm running KDE Plasma and Wayland with Secure Boot enabled. I learned a lot about low-level Linux ...
SecureBoot - Debian Wiki
NvidiaGraphicsDrivers - Debian Wiki
Install Nvidia Drivers Debian Bookworm Wayland
How to Install Nvidia Drivers on Debian 12, 11 or 10 - LinuxCapable ...

I left Secure Boot enabled to appease Windows 11. I managed to get it installed without a Microsoft account by choosing the English International product:
Download Windows 11 Download Windows 11 Disk Image (ISO) for x64 devices Select Product Language: English International.

Larry

 

[wadup]

Thank you once again for your valuable input.

The Nvidia RTX A4000 (desktop version) specifies 140 Watt maximum power consumption. The Nvidia RTX A4000SFF (mobile version) spec. is: 70 Watts.

It is interesting that the BIOS Power Limit settings automatically change when the GPU is installed in the PCIe slot. So far, with the GPU installed, I haven't seen system total power consumption exceed 100 Watts, but I hadn't changed the BIOS Advanced/Power Limit 1 or Power Limit 2 settings from 45000 and 60000 respectively. I'll set them back to 60000 and 80000 and monitor power consumption.

I only recently managed to get the Nvidia-driver (525.147.05) installed. This was a bit complex task with Debian Bookworm running KDE Plasma and Wayland with Secure Boot enabled. I learned a lot about low-level Linux ...
SecureBoot - Debian Wiki
NvidiaGraphicsDrivers - Debian Wiki
Install Nvidia Drivers Debian Bookworm Wayland
How to Install Nvidia Drivers on Debian 12, 11 or 10 - LinuxCapable ...

I left Secure Boot enabled to appease Windows 11. I managed to get it installed without a Microsoft account by choosing the English International product:
Download Windows 11 Download Windows 11 Disk Image (ISO) for x64 devices Select Product Language: English International.

Larry

I am also seeing people have no power issues with a2000/a4000 sff with 45000 and 60000 power limits.

 

[LDighera]

Installing the Nvidia RTX A4000SFF driver on Windows 11 Professional has been even more problematic than on Linux, resulting in several reinstallation attempts. Lacking an image of the original Windows system installed on the MS-01 was evidently part of the activation problem, as using the original Minisforum MS Product Key, obtained with

CMD in Administrator mode, enter:

C:\Windows\System32>wmic path softwareLicensingService get OA3xOriginalProductKeyOA3xOriginalProductKey

or

PowerShell in Administrator mode, enter:

(Get-WmiObject -query 'select * from SoftwareLicensingService').OA3xOriginalProductKey

was rejected by the Windows installer.

Eventually, diligence paid off, and I successfully had an activated Win 11 Pro system.
Using the Minisforum MS-01 driver store was crucial.

The Nvidia driver was quite unstable, and caused repeated BSOD reboots. Fortunately, I found these two pages: Nvidia Driver Crashing on Windows 11: How to Fix it and https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/forums/game-ready-drivers/13/497027/drivers-causing-freezes-hangs-on-windows-11/3275495/#!/friends that contained useful tips.

The first page provided this:

4. Reconfigure settings in Nvidia Control Panel
Launch the Nvidia Control Panel from the search menu.
Next, select the Manage 3D Settings option under 3D Settings from the navigation pane on the left.
Click on the Vertical sync dropdown menu, and select Off from the list of options.
Also, make sure that Power management mode is set to Prefer maximum performance.
Save the changes, restart the computer, and check if the error is fixed.

The second page provided a remarkably useful tool (HWinfo64), and additional debugging insight:

Download HWinfo64(See first Image below): Free Download HWiNFO Sofware | Installer & Portable for Windows, DOS
Run Hwinfo64
• Sensors Only
• bottom right - Logging (start that - This creates the LOG FILE)
• Leave it running in the Background
Log file is the Most important part.
If the computer reboots or crashed, I want that log file as it is still created.

Download DDU 18.0.4.6 or Newer:

Display Driver Uninstaller (DDU) V18.0.5.0 Released.

Display Driver Uninstaller (DDU) V18.0.5.0 Released. ChangeLog: Intel: Added several cleanup additions / enhancement. All: Fixed an issue with the "components" registry clean-up. All:added additional command lines arguments. -RemoveAMDKMPFD -RemoveAudioBus -RemoveVulkan Translations: updated...

www.wagnardsoft.com

IMAGE HERE: How_to_navigate_Wagnard.png

Disconnect the NETWORK Cable | WIFI (I Disable these in the DEVICE MANAGER)

[win]+[r] > Msconfig > Boot(tab) > Boot Option> check the SAFE BOOT(minimal) ... Apply and Reboot.

Run DDU (see Settings Below)
• Select: NVIDIA Software and drivers
• Select: Clean, do not restart
Shutdown and Reboot.

The Nvidia Control Panel settings above resulted in much improved stability, and Windows ran for an hour or more without crashing; still far from perfect, but stable enough to enable further debugging.

Later I found these Windows Installation pages from Minisforum: How to installation Windows 10/11? and How to install the driver without exe and bat files. Although the first one mentions the necessity for a Windows Product Key for activation, it fails to provide any way of actually obtaining it, so I hope you have saved yours with the command(s) above.

Using HWinfo64 provided real-time insight into system voltage and temperature dynamics.
From this thread, it appears that addressing the I9 CPU overheating issue is a priority next step toward stability.

Larry

 

[bobbysteel]

The n3rdware sff heatsink for the a2000 works great and it should work just the same for the a4000 too. I just had to cut the bracket w a dremel so it fit properly.

http://imgur.com/Qf1RwrI

http://imgur.com/ayHyR6V

 

[BBQ9]

The n3rdware sff heatsink for the a2000 works great and it should work just the same for the a4000 too. I just had to cut the bracket w a dremel so it fit properly.

http://imgur.com/Qf1RwrI

http://imgur.com/ayHyR6V

Where did you source your a2000 sff ?
my google-foo is failing me at the moment and I seem to only find the higher powered a2000 a4000 which I don’t need.

thank (humbly)

 

[piranha32]

Where did you source your a2000 sff ?
my google-foo is failing me at the moment and I seem to only find the higher powered a2000 a4000 which I don’t need.

thank (humbly)

if you're in the US, I found 12G version in Microcenter for $600 PNY NVIDIA RTX A2000 Single Fan 12GB GDDR6 PCIe 4.0 Graphics Card - Micro Center

 

[BBQ9]

if you're in the US, I found 12G version in Microcenter for $600 PNY NVIDIA RTX A2000 Single Fan 12GB GDDR6 PCIe 4.0 Graphics Card - Micro Center

thanks. Wish I lived near a microcenter. LOL.
This helps as I hadn’t appreciated the 12Gb version was also the sff version. The “a4000 sff” uses the sff in the name and I just couldn’t find an “a2000 sff”

 

[piranha32]

thanks. Wish I lived near a microcenter. LOL.
This helps as I hadn’t appreciated the 12Gb version was also the sff version. The “a4000 sff” uses the sff in the name and I just couldn’t find an “a2000 sff”

I think they can also ship. And if you are not in the US, and desperate enough, you can try to use a forwarder.

 

[bobbysteel]

Yeah I'm in Europe so had to find it on ebay. Not at home but I also made a baffle to redirect air and drilled a 8mm hole diagonal through the stock cpu cooling fans to allow more air egress. Will take a pic next week.