Xeon CPU improvements over the years...

[BLinux]

I'm building a new server with old L5640 CPUs. When I compare that CPU against comparable ones from later generations, I see hardly a difference:

L5640 vs E5-2630Lv2:

Intel Xeon L5640 vs E5 2630L v2

L5640 vs E5-2630Lv3:

Intel Xeon L5640 vs E5-2630L v3

I know some of the data on cpuboss isn't accurate; but it really doesn't seem like there have been big leaps forward in this stuff per clock cycle. When I factor in the cost of a L5640 @$20, it just doesn't seem to make sense to spend much more unless I need support for massive amounts of RAM (> 256GB). The Westmere-EP platform seems completely still relevant after 6 years?!

Am I missing something? Is there significant improvements that aren't revealed in the synthetic benchmarks?

 

[capn_pineapple]

Instruction set, power efficiency and motherboard features are where it's at.

IPC has been somewhat significant with around 30% improvement per cycle (iirc) but yes, it's all pretty lacklustre between generations atm.

 

[MiniKnight]

Well CPU Boss is usually junk. That's the main problem.

Let's use some real data? Maybe Patrick and William have better data but here's a recent pic from the a Ryzen review (hot linking hope it is OK since it's from STH)

That doesn't have the L5640 but it has the much higher frequency X5670's. Dual X5670's, by that chart are scoring maybe a 5.6 or 5.7? A single E5-2630L V3 is scoring 4.9? If you take into account the L5640's were slower by 15-20% you're basically to where 2x L5640's = 1x E5-2630L V3.

I'm just going to use the V3 since that's the obvious one. Here's ARK Intel® Product Specification Comparison

Single Thread CPU - Not even close
L5640
2.8GHz max turbo
2MB L3/ core
and OLD speed step tech

E5-2630L V3
2.9GHz max turbo
2.5MB L3 / core

Using conservative 7% compounding IPC gain per generation, that's roughly a 3.5GHz L5640.

Same reason Xeon D is competitive with L5640's even with fewer cores. Here's an old one where they had the L5640 against Xeon D. This is the review that pushed me to replace L5640 systems with Xeon D which is why I remembered it Intel Xeon D-1541 Benchmarks - the minor speed jump

Multi-threaded - Not even close
8 cores v. 6 cores. Clocks are lower on the E5-2630L V3 for base but the all core turbos on them will be higher than the L5640. There's a 1.1GHz base to turbo for E5L V3 and only 533MHz for L5640.

Then add IPC improvements. More cores, higher IPC, more cache.

CPU that seems like it matches the chart cross linked.

Instructions - Important
AVX 2.0 on the E5-2630L V3, AVX wasn't part of the spec before E5's. Massive gains if used.

RAM - Not even close. 2.67 x capacity and ~2x bandwidth.

L5640
3x 1333 = 32GB/s
Max 288GB

E5-2630L V3
4x 1866 = 59GB/s
Max 768GB

Rest of System - E5 V3 demolishes
No Northbridge sucking 20w+ and possibly 2 of them to get more PCIe lanes. Big part why your newer systems use like 1/2 the power or less at idle
PCIe2 only on L5640 systems not 3 now
SATA3 x 10 E5 V3, SATA2 x 6 L5600

Summary ---- Sure they're $20 but when you're spending $20/ mo more per machine per month it's game over. Let's say you want a SATA3 SSD. Now you need a HBA that can't even run at PCIe3. Want to have a dual port 40G? Nope. Want to NVMe? Sorry. Heck, there are even hard drives that can go too fast for SATA II.

Maybe not enough cost savings to rip them, but it's hard to tell someone to buy them now.

My biggest move has been because I don't feel comfortable with 55/5600 gear in the field. L5640 was launched 7 years ago and many were L5520 systems before so those are 8 years old? Caps start to fry.

Summary - don't use CPU Boss for server chips.

 

[Jeggs101]

@MiniKnight that's harsh but it's true.

 

[Evan]

I would have to agree with @MiniKnight

But it does depend what you use it for, if you don't pay for power or it's just for sometimes usage(or not 24x7 home server) then the fact you can get dual L5640's or X5670's and better for pretty much nothing and often with no less than 72gb if not 144/196gb ram then may make sense.

 

[RobertFontaine]

In a home server environment, 24/7 use isn't expensive enough to be compelling as an upgrade justification. For example, I use a dell optiplex 990 as a pfsense server. It would take me about 20 years of power differential to justify a modern low power alternative. Individually power saving is a false economy. Additionally, in most cases, the actual processor requirements of home lab servers mean that old hardware is entirely adequate to running headless minimal install Linux servers; FTP, SMTP, LDAP, HTTP etc.

They would suck at rendering, data mining or anything remotely fun as compared to modern architectures but a smart home dungeon owner would give some of this old cheap hardware consideration as a part of the lab. Sadly I'm not a terribly smart home dungeon owner, a common issue on this forum, and I am trying to figure out how to justify another 256gb of ddr4, a couple of 12-14 core v3's and 90 or so usable terabytes of zfs in the lab. As unnecessary as the supercharger kit on my mid-90's M3 that I never seem to drive.

 

[Patrick]

@MiniKnight - no issues hotlinking STH main site to the forums.

The general thought is right, and power differential for the same performance is huge.

BTW @RobertFontaine I installed my own Dinan supercharger on a '99 M Coupe (#191). That was a hoot! Of course, that also meant a M5 clutch, lightweight flywheel, brakes, custom springs/ shocks and 4 different sets of wheels. Lots more I am likely forgetting. Track days in the supercharged M makes used IT equipment look cheap.

 

[RobertFontaine]

I have a 97 with everything rubber refreshed, bilstiens, a z3 steering rack, vf-engineering kit, exhaust,headers, cross brace, a couple of pairs of shoes, and more than I should admit to. It has been sitting on blocks for almost a year. Need to get out to the garage and get it finished this year. It's not the fastest or the coolest but it puts a silly smile on my face.

 

[BLinux]

@RobertFontaine[/USER] I installed my own Dinan supercharger on a '99 M Coupe (#191). That was a hoot! Of course, that also meant a M5 clutch, lightweight flywheel, brakes, custom springs/ shocks and 4 different sets of wheels. Lots more I am likely forgetting. Track days in the supercharged M makes used IT equipment look cheap.

Didn't think I'd find a E36/8 owner here...

I have a 97 with everything rubber refreshed, bilstiens, a z3 steering rack, vf-engineering kit, exhaust,headers, cross brace, a couple of pairs of shoes, and more than I should admit to. It has been sitting on blocks for almost a year. Need to get out to the garage and get it finished this year. It's not the fastest or the coolest but it puts a silly smile on my face.

Are you guys also on the BMW forums?

 

[Patrick]

Didn't think I'd find a E36/8 owner here...

Are you guys also on the BMW forums?

My last BMW was a 335i that lasted <1 year with monthly trips to the shop.

Switched to another brand to haul servers.

 

[Fzdog2]

You always find car guys in the depths of random forums. 89 Skyline GTR myself.

 

[BLinux]

You always find car guys in the depths of random forums. 89 Skyline GTR myself.

Car guy, in a forum dominated by men/boys, sure... but a E36/8 owner... those are rare in general

 

[Evan]

You always find car guys in the depths of random forums. 89 Skyline GTR myself.

Living in Singapore now buy used to be a GTR guys, opened 32,33, & 34's , anything from nice 450hp street to 900hp track but registered cars, also had a very nice Evo 6 that was a great city car.
Would probably consider a BMW M2 or something as a close to ideal car to drive daily but let's see when I move to a country where I need to and makes sense to drive in again.

 

[T_Minus]

LOL, glad to see more vehicle folk here!! As Patrick said, servers are cheap compared to autos haha!
I think I'll start a General Chat discussion on Vehicle Projects for everyone to share!

 

[Diavuno]

CPUs have come a long way... How you use them is a big deal... Home labs or low CPU requirements are good uses for older stuff...

But their age and reliability should be factored in...

Im planning my upgrades now. I have a TON of 55/56 stuff running


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