What's a decent modern PCIe or USB wireless access point card?

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thrasher

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Jul 12, 2021
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I have a... fairly dumb setup. But hear me out.

My home has 10GE fiber connectivity. If I have a server with some 10GE Ethernet ports and I want to bolt on a modern access point that can make use of the 10GE pipe, what is the fastest PCIe WiFi access point I can buy?

I don't have a 10GE switch and don't really want to spend $200 and 50-100W on a separate switch when my server only draws ~80W idle.

Do you know of any alternative to the QWA-AC2600?
 

i386

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Mar 18, 2016
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I'm not sure what you are asking...

Do you need a wifi adapter?
Or an access point (think ruckus/aruba/cisco aps)?
 

thrasher

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Jul 12, 2021
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I suppose what I'm doing here is way too stupid to be even technically feasible today.

There aren't any good PCIe cards that support WiFi APs, even including the QNAP part. I'll just use the server (or a VM within it) as a router and add a normal AP on a 1GE link downstream later.
 

ms264556

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Sep 13, 2021
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If the server ports are copper then there's a bunch of high-end APs which do 2.5gb ethernet connection. E.g. Ruckus R650/R750, Omada EAP660 HD. I'm sure most AP manufacturers have something 2.5gb. There's 5gb APs too, if you want to spend $$$ (e.g. Ruckus R730, R850).
 

victhor393

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Feb 13, 2022
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You could buy one of those Compex cards and use a mini PCIe adapter, though I think some of these may need 5V to work and not all adapters do that, since it's not standard. There is also AsiaRF that sells mt76 cards. I never used either of those though.
One point to consider is that not only are these cards expensive, but they can only operate in one band at a time (if they're not fixed to a single band), you would need 2 cards to get both 2.4 and 5GHz.
 

thrasher

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Jul 12, 2021
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One point to consider is that not only are these cards expensive, but they can only operate in one band at a time (if they're not fixed to a single band), you would need 2 cards to get both 2.4 and 5GHz.
yeah it's just not worth it
 

Stephan

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Apr 21, 2017
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I myself am using a TL-WDN4800 with patched hostapd, which will use the blob-free Atheros ath9k driver on Linux. Truly the pinnacle of wifi freedom. Problem in your case is speed, because this card will limit you to ~21 MByte/sec IP throughput. It is 802.11n and that's it. Patch will prevent the 40 MHz channel becoming 20 MHz should neighbors with Wifi also exist. Anything later than 2012 will be ath10k or ath11k (Qualcomm bought Atheros) and the blobs will become a necessity.

To get more speed you will need a card that supports 802.11ac or ax. Like an ALFA Network AWPCIE-AX200. So Intel, with blob. Beware this card has two IPEX4/MHF4 connectors not U.FL like the old cards, so you will need two MHF4 to RP-SMA pigtails which you can then screw into the slot of a "wireless card adapter" like this: 300M DUAL BAND WIRELESS Desktop WIFI WLAN CARD PCI-E 1X Adapter Intel 4965AGN | eBay Make sure it has 2-3 real holes for RP-SMA and does not use PCB mounted RP-SMA solder connectors. Because those usually have U.FL connectors with a small pigtail soldered onto the PCB.

You might need 1-2 meters of good quality cabling to clear the grounded server/PC case and get your antennae into a better spot than right on the back of the case. Lots of RG-XX trash around, anything at 2.4 GHz with loss >> 0.5dB per meter really is not worth it. CFD300 or even CFD400 will do, like this: Delock Produkte 90464 Delock Antennenkabel RP-SMA Stecker zu RP-SMA Buchse LMR/CFD300 2 m low loss

Finally you will need some antennae. Dual band RP-SMA paddle type dipoles are omnidirectional and cheap, but I wouldn't buy the 2 USD Amazon steal, because those can and will be off-center 100 MHz of the wifi band and you will never know it. So I recommend a reputable brand like Panorama Antennas, e.g. this one: PWB-24-58 | Dual Band 2.4/5.0GHz WiFi Terminal Paddle Antenna You get what you pay for. If you need more range you will need to go directional, my go-to brand is Poynting. E.g. this one WLAN-61 - Poynting Tech - Antenna Solutions, South Africa, USA & Europe Of course you could also build one yourself for 3 bucks, see the many videos by Andrew McNeil like this one
And here is a really funny option Datei:Yagi-Uda antenna for Wi-Fi on Router.jpg – Wikipedia

AsiaRF and mt76 I hear are upcoming options for Wifi freaks once the last ath9k card has died. Also many patches are going into the Linux kernel for different chips of this type. But such a card might be hard to source.

Edit: Probably the wrong "wireless card adapter" because for small cards you need to solder. But you get the idea. Mini PCIe is also not NGFF.
 
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thrasher

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Jul 12, 2021
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Great reply, Stephan. I have an AR928X card already that supports hosting on 2.4 GHz channels and does work with ordinary hostapd+ath9k. It just feels a little dumb to not share more than 21 Mbps of the 10GE link with wireless devices.

What really confuses me is how people on the OpenWRT forum say "10GE needs x86 for the performance." Well, what x86 routers are out there with onboard wireless access points? Surely they're mostly using a high-end PCIe card! But I can't find any (other than the Compex cards).
 

NateS

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Apr 19, 2021
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What really confuses me is how people on the OpenWRT forum say "10GE needs x86 for the performance." Well, what x86 routers are out there with onboard wireless access points? Surely they're mostly using a high-end PCIe card! But I can't find any (other than the Compex cards).
That's for stuff like complex routing and firewall duties, and that does not have to be in the same box as your wifi.

A more typical setup would be to add a wireless access point connected by a second 10Ge link to your server (or 2.5Ge or whatever meets your wireless needs). That way, all the engineering of what types of antennas and where they should be placed is already done, and you just mount the box somewhere instead of basically trying to recreate it from parts. Especially with more modern wifi standards that support things like 4x4 MIMO, getting that right is hard. And that way your x86 server can still do all the firewalling between the internet and your wifi.
 
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Stephan

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To avoid a bottleneck, 10 gigabit/sec requires a beefy CPU beyond low-power fanless ARM/MIPS designs. Anything Skylake or better really, if you need to do even the slightest processing with the data like filtering instead of just routing from one end to the other. Come to think of it, anything Coffee Lake Refresh or later really, because that is the first CPU which doesn't have dog-slow context switch times because of all the Meltdown/Spectre fixes. Thanks, Intel. Even the two 10G-BaseT ports will be bordering on requiring a cooling fan at least somewhere, to get rid of 10 watts TDP. Apple M1 is the first ARM silicon which could be used, even fanless, but it is not commercially available to 3rd party designs.

So OpenWRT guys are correct.

Absolute max speed with Wifi 6 at 5 GHz and 160 MHz channel width seems to be around 1400 Mbps throughput. Only if you are basically in the same room and 1 meter away from AP. Next room we are talking 400-600 Mbps at most.
 
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LodeRunner

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Absolute max speed with Wifi 6 at 5 GHz and 160 MHz channel width seems to be around 1400 Mbps throughput. Only if you are basically in the same room and 1 meter away from AP. Next room we are talking 400-600 Mbps at most.
And that will be the PHY rate, not your actual throughput. Also, 160 MHz channels are not friendly to neighbors and will take more interference and thus have more retransmits, lowering the effective throughput even more.

So honestly, shoot for getting a good AP and if it has a 2.5 or 5G port, whatever, connect it at 1G. Unless you live in an anechoic chamber, you're extremely unlikely to be able to pump a full gig over wireless.
 
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cageek

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Jun 22, 2018
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I couldn't get the Intel m.2 cards to work as a host adapter in AC mode only G, etc. Driver support. I don't know about the AX ones, but I would check before ordering. I ended up going with a Qualcomm m.2 card (search ebay - qca6174a,qcnfa364a,qcnfa344a) - real cheap as they're people's laptop pulls. They're never going to be as good as a decent AP as others have said here.
 

thrasher

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Jul 12, 2021
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I guess true wireless freedom will remain in old hardware at least until there's a WiFi 6 AP block in GNURadio.

At least I can use an OpenWRT VM on my x86 machine to do firewalling/routing and offload the WiFi duties to another piece of hardware.
 
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