Lenovo Thinkcentre/ThinkStation Tiny (Project TinyMiniMicro) Reference Thread

[jja2000]

No. It seems the x16 physical riser does only work for graphics cards on the arrow lake platform. I have the same issue with my P3 Tiny G2. The x4 riser does work.

I have the same problem with my M90q Gen 5 as I described earlier in the thread. I opened a ticket with Lenovo, but they claim it's an electrical incompatibility with the riser... I guess if you want to use anything other than a GPU you need the smaller riser.

 

[Stovar]

I tried these 2 lenova riser cards on my M90q Gen 6 and only the top one fitted, but did not detect any sata/raid/network or nvme addon cards. The green light appeared on the addon cards oddly but no detection in windows 11 or linux. Did not have a gpu to test it since not a gamer. Wish they just kept it as a normal pci-e slot!







Lenova were pretty clueless when I asked them if they sell the riser they just gave me the link to lenova spare parts and that was when I told them already checked it. The manual mentions the riser card but does not list the part number or name either.

 

[invik]

I had an issue with a X550-T2 with the SR-IOV on my M720q. Even when following this post: SR-IOV activation, it did not work. The kernel modules were loaded, all the logs seemed fine.

But I had an Permission denied error when running the echo 4 > /sys/class/net/enp1s0f0/device/sriov_numvfs command.

It turned out that SR-IOV had to be activated in the UEFI for each of the ports in Devices->ATA Drive Setup->Intel (R) Ethernet 10G 2P X550-t Adapter->Device Level Configuration->Virtualization Mode
They were on 'None'. Setting them on 'SR-IOV' solved my issue.

It is quite strange that these parameters end up in 'ATA Drive Setup' but there they are.

 

[cokecan72]

This is a fun one, I considered making one like that myself as well but didn't have the time to, so I'm glad someone else made it real (though it would've been nice if the source files were available). It makes use of the fact that PCIe lanes from the Intel PCH can be reconfigured in firmware (I have an explanation about that here, though it seems they streamlined the flashing process for this specific adapter and platform).

In this case it's splitting the x4 link into 4 x1 links and using a clock buffer to split the refclk to the 4 slots. That gets you 4 drives running at PCIe 3.0 x1 off of the PCH, so up to just under 1GB/s per drive, and you still have the full PCIe x8 slot from the CPU as well (though with the SSDs installed you won't have much space lol).

It's a pretty cool riser in theory. I haven't seen it in practical use, but I imagine it works just fine. Seems to be using an extra buck converter to run the SSDs off of the beefier 12V rail so there should be no concerns about going over the tiny's onboard 3.3V regulator's limit, it just counts to the maximum total shared with the 12V for the PCIe slot now.

Thanks for the explanation here. Very interesting!

Obviously I know this custom riser isn't from you so you may not know, but can I just clarify something; If it's using the x4 PCIe lanes from the PCH/DMI then presumably they are the same lanes that's shared with wifi/usb/sata etc? Also this riser has what appears to be an x4 PCIe slot on it too. How does this work? It can't surely share the same lanes can it? if so that'll be terrible performance

My understanding from j4cbo's riser is that Lenovo exposes x8 CPU lanes in addition to the x4 PCH/DMI lanes on this connector. Where j4cbo's appears to be different is that he uses half of the x8 CPU lanes for one M.2 connector while the other x4 are used for a PCIe expansion card while also tapping into the x4 PCH/DMI lanes for the second M.2 slot. This would give both M.2 slots on the riser x4 lanes each though one of them would be shared with USB/WIfi/Sata etc. Based on how I've understood the PCIe lane architecture in the M920, it just made me wonder how this TaoBao riser is electrically wired

 

[WifiCable]

Thanks for the explanation here. Very interesting!

Obviously I know this custom riser isn't from you so you may not know, but can I just clarify something; If it's using the x4 PCIe lanes from the PCH/DMI then presumably they are the same lanes that's shared with wifi/usb/sata etc? Also this riser has what appears to be an x4 PCIe slot on it too. How does this work? It can't surely share the same lanes can it? if so that'll be terrible performance

My understanding from j4cbo's riser is that Lenovo exposes x8 CPU lanes in addition to the x4 PCH/DMI lanes on this connector. Where j4cbo's appears to be different is that he uses half of the x8 CPU lanes for one M.2 connector while the other x4 are used for a PCIe expansion card while also tapping into the x4 PCH/DMI lanes for the second M.2 slot. This would give both M.2 slots on the riser x4 lanes each though one of them would be shared with USB/WIfi/Sata etc. Based on how I've understood the PCIe lane architecture in the M920, it just made me wonder how this TaoBao riser is electrically wired

These riser slots have 8 lanes from the CPU and 4 lanes from the PCH in them. The PCH lanes share bandwidth with everything else connected to the PCH as you say.
On Tiny5 the PCH's DMI uplink to the CPU is equivalent to PCIe 3.0 x4 so that's how much bandwidth is available for USB/SATA/Wifi/LAN, the bottom NVMe slots and the PCH lanes in the riser slot combined.

That riser puts the 8 lanes from the CPU directly in the x8 slot, and takes the 4 lanes from the PCH and runs one to each NVMe slot.

j4cbo's riser does something different, it uses 4 of the CPU lanes for the PCIe x4 slot, the other 4 CPU lanes for one of the NVMe slots and then the 4 PCH lanes for the final NVMe slot

 

[sw1]

I found a cheap used Tiny8 (M90q Gen 3) and, even though it hasn't arrived, I'm pretty sure it doesn't come with a riser. On AliExpress I see the riser goes for ~US$60. Is that really the case? I asume generic/no-brand ones are still not available like the ones for the Tiny5 that cost less than US$10?

 

[Stovar]

I found a cheap used Tiny8 (M90q Gen 3) and, even though it hasn't arrived, I'm pretty sure it doesn't come with a riser. On AliExpress I see the riser goes for ~US$60. Is that really the case? I asume generic/no-brand ones are still not available like the ones for the Tiny5 that cost less than US$10?

Yeah that is the issue there appears only 2 type of riser cards, I posted the ones above there is that cheaper one around £10-15 then the expensive one around £30-40 which has extra capicitors, chipsets (see 3-4 post above). The cheap one never fit into my gen 6 lenova, only the expensive one that cost £30-40. You might be able to get an idea by looking at the slot length and pins if it may fit your lenova. I was unaware it only supported gpus on my system though so had to return it.

I would recommend you purchase from amazon or a seller in which you can return it in case it does not work, its a known issue some arrive dead.

 

[ZombieBiceps]

The cheaper one you tried is for the Tiny4's.

The correct part numbers for the m90q gen 3 are:
PCIEx4 riser = 5C50W00909
PCIEx8 riser = 5C50W00910 or 5C50W00933
PCIEx16 riser = 5C50W00933 or 5C50W00910

I'm not sure if you have to use different risers depending on which kind of card you are using as I've only ever used a GPU with the PCIEx16 riser. The information will be in this thread somewhere for you. In the UK its always cheapest to get one from AliExpress unless Lenovo has the parts on sale direct.

I've bought risers from AliExpress for every generation of the tiny's starting from 4 till 8 which is the m90q gen 3 and every single one has worked perfect no issues. If you do decided to shop there just be wary of listings that seem very cheap as they usually have sub options where you are only getting the backing plate.

This is the link to the x16 riser I got if you are after that one. (Assuming prices remain the same ratio between each other) Its the cheapest I could find after a few weeks of looking.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006503697100.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.main.7.587c9aVc9aVciM&algo_pvid=088578fa-7574-4153-8170-e298abc2af82&pdp_ext_f=%7B%22order%22%3A%227%22%2C%22eval%22%3A%221%22%2C%22fromPage%22%3A%22search%22%7D&utparam-url=scene%3Asearch%7Cquery_from%3A%7Cx_object_id%3A1005006503697100%7C_p_origin_prod%3A

 

[dan154]

Wondering if there is any chance the chart on page 1 will be updated to include the newer P3 and P3 gen 2 systems, looking to get some more info to see how those compare across the series from the older generations

 

[SteveFP]

Just wanted to let ppl know that if you choose to upgrade your Tiny system with an Intel E610 10 gig card you will need to use the x4 riser card. The x16 riser card does not see the card for some reason. I guess I am going to chalk it up to what was indicated about the difference each riser card gets its PCIe lanes.

 

[SteveFP]

I tried these 2 lenova riser cards on my M90q Gen 6 and only the top one fitted, but did not detect any sata/raid/network or nvme addon cards. The green light appeared on the addon cards oddly but no detection in windows 11 or linux. Did not have a gpu to test it since not a gamer. Wish they just kept it as a normal pci-e slot!

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Lenova were pretty clueless when I asked them if they sell the riser they just gave me the link to lenova spare parts and that was when I told them already checked it. The manual mentions the riser card but does not list the part number or name either.

You might want to try the x4 version of the riser card. I just went through a situation where the Intel E610 adapter card will not work with the x16 riser, only the x4 version.

 

[cromo]

I bought an m75q1 for use as a NAS with ECC memory. Everything is fine here, except I also want to connect my PCIe ASM1166 card over the m2 a+e to PCIe adapter I bought on Aliexpress:



To my surprise, even though the LEDs on the card light up and turn off in usual fashion, it doesn't get detected by the OS. I tried in 2 other wystems, an m720q and m920x (with coreboot firmware), to no avail. I assumed the adapter was broken until I tested it with an m2 e-key full-blown B650 ASUS motherboard, where it worked just fine.

I am baffled. What's going on here? Any ideas? For the record, I tested with 12V connected. I know these a+e m2 slots can take extension cards directly into the slot, so why wouldn't the PCIe adapter cable work? What am I missing?

EDIT: DAMN, I figured it out, it wasn't the adapter cable, after all. I plugged a WiFi card in and enabled the Wireless Card in Networking. It was disabled. This is the answer to the multitude of reports of that randomness reported all over the Internet, where m2 cards work for some and don't work for others on the same models.

 

[Gr3yh0und]

This would be a fun addition to the tiny... But only with at least a RTL8157 on USB or another 10GbE on the 3.0x1 slot.

Interesting AMD FCH-on-a-Stick Addon Card Gives the Appearance of Intel CPU on AMD Chipset

AMD creates the top X670E and X870E chipsets by joining two AMD "Promontory 21" FCH chips at the hip. Each of these takes in a PCI-Express 4.0 x4 connection, and puts out 8 PCIe 4.0 lanes and four SATA 6 Gbps ports that can be re-configured as four additional Gen 3 lanes. The X870E/X670E chipset...

www.techpowerup.com

 

[besseddrest]

Wondering if there is any chance the chart on page 1 will be updated to include the newer P3 and P3 gen 2 systems, looking to get some more info to see how those compare across the series from the older generations

hey there, I've actually built a p3 tiny gen 1 from used parts, happy to answer any questions you might have, hopefully i'm not too limited i knowledge

 

[hoppel118]

Hello everyone,

I was a bit torn between buying an m90q Gen 5 or Gen 6. However, I now know that the Gen 6 will not work for my use case.

@Stovar @Gr3yh0und @MBastian Thank you for all the information.

I am now leaning towards the m90q Gen 5. Is there any reason not to do so?

I want to use the PCIe slot via a riser card with one of the following 25GBit network cards:

• Intel e810xxv-da2
• Mellanox ConnectX 4 MCX4111A
• Mellanox ConnectX 4 MCX4121A
• Mellanox ConnectX 5 MSC512A
• Mellanox ConnectX 6 MCX631102AS

Does anyone here have experience with one of these network cards in terms of ASPM support or other parameters that allow deeper C states?

Otherwise, I would like to install the following equipment:

• 1x 32GB RAM
• 2x Samsung 990 Pro 2TB

If possible, it should be ECC RAM. Is ECC RAM compatible with the m90q Gen 5? If so, which module should I ideally buy?


Thank you and best regards, Hoppel

 

[DagB]

Hi all. What is the minimum PSU I can get away with for a P340 tiny i7-10700t?
35W CPU,
7W network card,
32GB memory,
2TB m.2 NVME

I find a claim online about a 123W peak power for the 10700T. (PL2) Can anyone confirm this? And does this, in fact, exclude running my unit with a 90W PSU?