Lenovo Thinkcentre/ThinkStation Tiny (Project TinyMiniMicro) Reference Thread

[KevinR]

Thanks for the info. I've actually got a replacement motherboard now, looks identical to my dead one. I put the riser card in first without the NIC, worked fine, added the quad NIC, still works! So it seems the parts are compatible, but maybe I accidentally shorted something on the first one.

I would suspect what ever blew up the first motherboard also blew the circuit on the lan card that shorted it out. Or part of the riser. It would be safer to put tape over the extra connector.

Example: Help with x540-t2 10gbe in 918+

 

[stumc]

I would suspect what ever blew up the first motherboard also blew the circuit on the lan card that shorted it out. Or part of the riser. It would be safer to put tape over the extra connector.

Example: Help with x540-t2 10gbe in 918+

My card doesn't have the extra connectors at the end

 

[sw1]

Can I run an NVMe SSD in the M.2-E wifi slot with an adapter? If so does anyone have some pics of how they gave done it? I am going to build a few of the riser cards with PCIex4 and 2 x NVMe slots, I want to use the onboard SATA, and 2 underside NVMe slots on my P330 Tiny. If the wifi slot is useable with an SSD can it be selected for boot?

I found this post in here: Lenovo Thinkcentre/ThinkStation Tiny (Project TinyMiniMicro) Reference Thread - I assume you can cut this board down shorter along the perforations?

Hi All,

I'm looking at putting an SSD in the spare wifi slot of a Lenovo M920q. I know that I can get an adapter for it to install an M.2 2230 NVME drive. That said, I have a 64GB eMMC lying around, which was pulled from my Steam Deck. Can I use that instead of an NVME SSD assuming I'm using the M.2 A/E key adapter in the wifi slot? The purpose would just be an OS drive for Proxmox, then use the other actual SSD slot for a larger NVME drive for VMs.

I don't know why everyone is ignoring you guys. Yes, it's possible to install a 2230 NVMe on the "WiFi Card Slot". You'lll need an adapter called something like "M.2 A/E Key Slot To M.2 M Key". Expect to pay ~US$5 (inc. shipping) if bought on AliExpress. Here's a link but remember that AliExpress items are not available on all regions. Here's also a picture of what it should look like:



Then, you'll need to make a few cuts to make it fit. Also remember that you can remove a metal piece around that area that's supposed to hold the bluetooth antena that you no longer need.

I'm no longer using my adapter since I'm planning to use that M.2 A/E Key slot for a 2.5 GbE NIC, but here's what it looks like after the required cuts, as well as the piece that can be removed for extra space.



The problem though is trying to use this drive as boot drive, you'll have to go through a lot of trial an error. Most of the time if that's the only drive Proxmox will install just fine and set it as boot drive, and then you add your other drives later, but if this strategy fails then you'll need to find your own since there's not a lot of documentation about this. An alternative is to use a pendrive as boot drive that'll then point the boot process to this drive, but I'm not familiar with that since thankfully I didn't have to go that route.

---

Are there any mini-SAS controllers that connect to an NVM M.2 M Key slot? Now that I have a custom riser with an extra NVMe slot, I'd like to connect 2/4 SAS drives on an external 3D printed enclosure. I found this on AliExpress for ~US$11 (inc. shipping), but not sure if it'd work


I also saw this one on Amazon US but not sure either. My plan would be to connect the drives using something like this "SFF-8643 Internal Mini SAS HD to (4) 29pin SFF-8482 connectors with SAS 15pin Power Port"

 

[epicurean]

@Geegeez
You can also consider getting a M.2 a+e key SSD card that works directly without adapters

 

[randythenerd]

I have a M720Q that I am wanting to find a NIC for to support 10gbe/2.5gbe routing using pfsense/OPNsense. I have access to 3d print various shrouds/fan mounts which I plan on doing either way. My ISP is able to provide 2.5gbe speeds, but my lan is running 10gbe. The intel x520 cards seem to work great for 10gbe, especially with fan mods, but from what I've researched cannot handshake 2.5gbe.

I have read that some 10gbe Mellanox SFP+ cards can work with 2.5gbe using specific transceivers. Does anyone have experience with this, or know of a card model they could share that would work to accomplish my task?

Or does anyone know of a multi gig sfp+ card that would work in a m720q?

 

[sw1]

I have a M720Q that I am wanting to find a NIC for to support 10gbe/2.5gbe routing using pfsense/OPNsense. I have access to 3d print various shrouds/fan mounts which I plan on doing either way. My ISP is able to provide 2.5gbe speeds, but my lan is running 10gbe. The intel x520 cards seem to work great for 10gbe, especially with fan mods, but from what I've researched cannot handshake 2.5gbe.

I have read that some 10gbe Mellanox SFP+ cards can work with 2.5gbe using specific transceivers. Does anyone have experience with this, or know of a card model they could share that would work to accomplish my task?

Or does anyone know of a multi gig sfp+ card that would work in a m720q?

I have the exact same problem, and only realized after getting the card.

I don't know much about this but I read here that some transceivers are able to negotiate at different speeds than just 10GbE ("SFP which incorporates a SGMII interface, which effectively separates the PHY and MAC negotiation speeds entirely") but those seem to be pretty expensive. The other option is using a card that uses the Intel XL710 chipset, my understanding is that those can negotiate 1/2.5/5/10GbE natively but are much more expensive and come with their own problems.

My idea was to get a 2.5GbE NIC that connects to the M.2 A/E Key ("WiFi/Bluetoth Card") Slot and print a baffle like this one.

I don't know what I'm going to do though since I don't have 3D modeling skills. I'm thinking about migrating to an SFF altogether, like an HP EliteDesk 800 G4 that offers 4 PCI-E slots and using a 2x10GbE SFP+ card for the LAN and a different card for WAN.

I'm not aware of any validation of PCI-E cards? I have a P360, so not the same model, but my AOC-STG-i4S has been working just fine without any modifications to it or the computer.

Something to consider is that the AOC-STGN-i2S/AOC-STG-i4S use the Intel XL710 chipset which means the SFP ports will only negotiate at either 1 or 10 Gbps and only with certain SFPs.

I've had a bit of an adventure on this front actually. I've been hankering to try an SFP which incorporates a SGMII interface, which effectively separates the PHY and MAC negotiation speeds entirely. I bought this from fs.com (not affiliated) https://www.fs.com/uk/products/178041.html?attribute=58324&id=1845437.

I originally bought a generic coded version and it did not work!! You must buy an Intel coded part to work with AOC-STGN-i2S/AOC-STG-i4S. Even allowing unsupported transceivers will not help you otherwise, i.e. "hw.ix.unsupported_sfp=1" in /boot/loader.conf.local on OPNsense. But now my NIC only sees a single 10Gbps Twinax device, but the RJ45 end can operate freely at 10M/100M/1G/2.5G/5G/10Gbps. This might be useful for your potential future proofing needs.

So I have finally setup a m720q tiny to replace an old R210ii, with my ATT fiber line.

I wanted to share this info for anyone who wants to move to a m720q tiny who has 2.5/5/10gb AT&T fiber line.

I have AT&T 2.5gb fiber.

The ATT BWG320 is the fiber modem I have to use, which has a 5GB rj45 port.

I tried to use the SuperMicro AOC-STGN-i2s NIC by I cannot get it to negotiate a 5GB connection.

pfsense recognizes the NIC, but I just cannot get a connection between it and the modem.

i have tried multiple transceivers, and still cannot get it to work.

I Assume the problem is with the x520 chipset negotiating a 5GB connection, with a transceiver - if anyone knows one that works please let me know.

i then tried to fit in my x710-T2L - which is rj45 10/5/2.5 GB.

As I pulled it out I forgot what a LONG boy this is.

so I was initially crest fallen, assuming it would not fit..

upon trying to jam it in the m720q tiny, the only thing blocking it was this thin piece of metal at the front of the chassis, which luckily is secured by one tiny screw, and popped out very easily!

This piece of metal I removed:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1164621435784925299/1193375069586587698/PXL_20240107_020519763.jpg?ex=65ac7c24&is=659a0724&hm=516c90a375fffe95ef23d1f0e2fc95380c2caabeb1db323f7944edd9c4ef18b4&

After removing this, the i710-t2l FIT like a dream.

I don't have a rear plastic baffle as it appears nobody has done this, but no big deal as the card is so long it rests on the back of the far side front USB ports. It's literally a perfect fit. It's rock solid, doesn't wobble at all, and the case still closes.

Here's a pic of the huge NIC installed:

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1164621435784925299/1193374164468371506/PXL_20240107_0152368462.jpg?ex=65ac7b4c&is=659a064c&hm=dced1c3193b0ef358e07ce43d943730e09b51ebff401697380932a9c3b66c40e&

The case closes up, and it works like a dream!

Bonus over the Super micro AOC-STGN-i2s NIC, is the X710-t2l runs a lot cooler, and has a heatsink twice the size.

Side question, in the above image I highlighted what I think is an antenna in purple. Is it safe to remove that?

It was resting in the metal piece I removed, and is just kinda loose now. It appears to be secured under the WiFi card with a single screw.

Anyway, wanted to share for anyone who wants to move to a m720q tiny who has 2.5/5/10gb AT&T fiber.

 

[Amdeez]

My idea was to get a 2.5GbE NIC that connects to the M.2 A/E Key ("WiFi/Bluetoth Card") Slot and print a baffle like this one.

The baffle you linked to is probably the nicest one I've seen -- doesn't look like a kid eating out of a high chair. I on the other hand, don't have a 3d printer or any patience. I picked up a shroud/fan from Untrusted Source and then ripped out the wifi/bluetooth and threw in an i226v->m2 nic.. It works for me.


Want to see something cursed? This Xikestore 2x AQC107(?) 10gb + NVME slots appears to fit in the 720s...

 

[sw1]

Want to see something cursed? This Xikestore 2x AQC107(?) 10gb + NVME slots appears to fit in the 720s...

View attachment 44801View attachment 44803View attachment 44804

That’s an interesting card. Got a link?

 

[Amdeez]

That’s an interesting card. Got a link?

I picked up the Xikestor SKN-2BT-M2 from their official AliExpress front. I haven't had a chance to figure out how to get the m2 storage on the card to work, though I do see them the NICs and the PLX chips for the M2s when I looked.

Check out the other AQC 10g nice on Ali. I picked up an AQC 10g PCIe 4.0x1 that actually delivers and takes up that spare x1 in a lot of new AMD motherboards.

 

[Geegeez]

Thank you @sw1 and @epicurean, I will give it a try.

 

[drcrow]

In case anyone finds this, if you are trying to use an x550-t2 nic with a p350 tiny, the x8 riser does not work! It will cause the system not to boot at all.

You need to use the x4 riser. Even though the x8 riser came with a GPU for the system and works fine with said GPU.

 

[sw1]

Does anyone know how many amps one can get from the 12V onboard the M920q?

I've seen people report online that they can power 2 x 3.5" HDDs from there, but would love if anyone knows for sure how many amps one could pull (limited also by the power supply, of course)

Also, if anyone has the proper pinout, that'd be nice too since the only picture I have is from the same link above but it's not very clear

Oh and, @WifiCable do you know this for the 12V pins on your TinyRiser v2.1?

 

[WifiCable]

Does anyone know how many amps one can get from the 12V onboard the M920q?

I've seen people report online that they can power 2 x 3.5" HDDs from there, but would love if anyone knows for sure how many amps one could pull (limited also by the power supply, of course)

Also, if anyone has the proper pinout, that'd be nice too since the only picture I have is from the same link above but it's not very clear

Oh and, @WifiCable do you know this for the 12V pins on your TinyRiser v2.1?

The M720q/M920q/M920x/P330's onboard 12V regulator is rated for 5.5A continuous, Tinyriser v2.1's 12V pins are meant for powering a fan and other low power things, not to get the full regulator's capacity out of. It's better to solder to these pads on the motherboard for 12V if you're comfortable with it.

 

[randythenerd]

I have the exact same problem, and only realized after getting the card.

I don't know much about this but I read here that some transceivers are able to negotiate at different speeds than just 10GbE ("SFP which incorporates a SGMII interface, which effectively separates the PHY and MAC negotiation speeds entirely") but those seem to be pretty expensive. The other option is using a card that uses the Intel XL710 chipset, my understanding is that those can negotiate 1/2.5/5/10GbE natively but are much more expensive and come with their own problems.

My idea was to get a 2.5GbE NIC that connects to the M.2 A/E Key ("WiFi/Bluetoth Card") Slot and print a baffle like this one.

I don't know what I'm going to do though since I don't have 3D modeling skills. I'm thinking about migrating to an SFF altogether, like an HP EliteDesk 800 G4 that offers 4 PCI-E slots and using a 2x10GbE SFP+ card for the LAN and a different card for WAN.

After some consideration I think I found my solution... It phased me that if I brought my fiber from my ONT directly to my router (the tiny w/ a 10gbe sfp+ card) that they should be able to negotiate/handshake connection with my device at 10gbps and then throttle it down to whatever speed im paying for. After talking to them it was funny to hear that that is what they do with majority of their own hardware, as 10gbe is still much cheaper these days with 2.5/5 being newer protocols.

So, at the end of the day, im not running any switches that have multigig or 2.5gbps ports, all of mine are 10, which is fine as the 10 to the switch will meet/exceed what my WAN will provide anyways... plus at least running 10gbps you have plenty of trunk lines.

+1 to the M.2 idea. I did this with some intel 6th gen tinys but didnt know where I would mount the extra port if I was using up pretty much all the real estate on the rear of the m720q with the available slot being used by the sfp+ card though im sure it could be done with a little 3d print engineering.

 

[sw1]

The M720q/M920q/M920x/P330's onboard 12V regulator is rated for 5.5A continuous, Tinyriser v2.1's 12V pins are meant for powering a fan and other low power things, not to get the full regulator's capacity out of. It's better to solder to these pads on the motherboard for 12V if you're comfortable with it.
View attachment 44812

That was a quick answer, thank you very much! Do you know what the other pads on the motherboard in this picture are for (black and red wires)?

EDIT: I haven't done this in a while, sorry. Those are the 4 cables I need to power the drives using something like the cables in the picture, right?

• Yellow: 12V
• Red: 5V
• 2 x Black: 2 x Ground

After some consideration I think I found my solution... It phased me that if I brought my fiber from my ONT directly to my router (the tiny w/ a 10gbe sfp+ card) that they should be able to negotiate/handshake connection with my device at 10gbps and then throttle it down to whatever speed im paying for. After talking to them it was funny to hear that that is what they do with majority of their own hardware, as 10gbe is still much cheaper these days with 2.5/5 being newer protocols.

So, at the end of the day, im not running any switches that have multigig or 2.5gbps ports, all of mine are 10, which is fine as the 10 to the switch will meet/exceed what my WAN will provide anyways... plus at least running 10gbps you have plenty of trunk lines.

+1 to the M.2 idea. I did this with some intel 6th gen tinys but didnt know where I would mount the extra port if I was using up pretty much all the real estate on the rear of the m720q with the available slot being used by the sfp+ card though im sure it could be done with a little 3d print engineering.

Glad you found a solution! I thought about that but my ISP will give me a hard time if I try to go that route. It may work, but I'd much rather avoid it.

As for the baffle, there's already one online I posted above (might need modifications depending on your actual card(s))

 

[WifiCable]

That was a quick answer, thank you very much! Do you know what the other pads on the motherboard in this picture are for (black and red wires)?

EDIT: I haven't done this in a while, sorry. Those are the 4 cables I need to power the drives using something like the cables in the picture, right?

• Yellow: 12V
• Red: 5V
• 2 x Black: 2 x Ground

View attachment 44816

View attachment 44814

Glad you found a solution! I thought about that but my ISP will give me a hard time if I try to go that route. It may work, but I'd much rather avoid it.

As for the baffle, there's already one online I posted above (might need modifications depending on your actual card(s))

The red ones are for 5V yes, the spot shown in the picture you attached is suitable. Same for where the black ground wires are soldered in the images. That's all you need to provide power to the drives.

 

[ZombieBiceps]

In case anyone finds this, if you are trying to use an x550-t2 nic with a p350 tiny, the x8 riser does not work! It will cause the system not to boot at all.

You need to use the x4 riser. Even though the x8 riser came with a GPU for the system and works fine with said GPU.

The x4 riser takes the lanes from the chipset rather than from the cpu, I'm not exactly sure why that causes network cards not to work when wired to the cpu though.

 

[cromo]

The M720q/M920q/M920x/P330's onboard 12V regulator is rated for 5.5A continuous, Tinyriser v2.1's 12V pins are meant for powering a fan and other low power things, not to get the full regulator's capacity out of. It's better to solder to these pads on the motherboard for 12V if you're comfortable with it.
View attachment 44812

Does anyone know if m710q onboard 12V regulator is rated for the same? I am looking to power 4 x SATA 3.5" HDDs out of that.

 

[WifiCable]

Does anyone know if m710q onboard 12V regulator is rated for the same? I am looking to power 4 x SATA 3.5" HDDs out of that.

Tiny4 has 2 different 12V regulators, one for the fan/other system stuff and one for the PCIe slot. Since the M710q board doesn't have the PCIe slot populated it only has the 12V regulator for the fan which is only rated for 1A continuous.
If it had been an M910x or P320 which does have the PCIe slot then it would've also had a 5.5A rated 12V regulator populated.
So sadly I don't think you're gonna be able to power 4 3.5" hard drives off of an M710q.

 

[Amdeez]

Thank you, I did the math and since I don't live in the EU it'd be really expensive (about the same amount of money I paid for the M920q itself)

I also found this on that same repo where the author explains how to use a PCB manufacturing contractor such as JLCPCB to have them build the risers in batches. Apparently a batch of 5 costs ~US$50.

I only have one machine and no plans of building a cluster so I think I'll just keep the cheap AliExpress riser. The extra storage would be cool but I don't need it. I also don't live in a popular country so group buying is not viable.

Thank you again for the input, it really helps to know the actual cost of those custom risers.

Is that $50 each or $50 total? I am in the USA and interested if its all up and ready to send