AMD Ryzen 7 Parts Available for Pre-Order Now!

Discussion in 'STH Main Site Posts' started by Patrick Kennedy, Feb 22, 2017.

  1. mstone

    mstone Active Member

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    I think you're misreading the graph. They were on a pretty steady upward trend until 2006 when the market was waiting for a quad core part. They flubbed it, their share dropped between 5 and 10 points (definitely more than 5) share--which was a decline of almost 50%--by the end of 07. They went up a little bit once they started shipping again but after that it was just a long slow downhill trend. They never recovered the positive momentum they had from 2003-2006.

    [snipping a lot of fanboyism]
    There's no point in trying to convince me that the parts aren't that bad, they haven't been selling and no amount of arguing on the internet is going to change that. If you take away the fact that there are a lot of cores, the single thread performance is still meh. So this comes down to "does the market really need a 8 core desktop processor"? The thing is, it's really hard to utilize a lot of cores. There are certain workloads which are embarrassingly parallel, and people doing that sort of thing are obviously happy. And certain overclocking performance fetishists will just love having a bunch of cores whether they are practical or not. But I'm unconvinced that many people will actually be able to maintain good utilization of an 8 core desktop--which is why intel hasn't been selling them (it's not a technical challenge). All of which raises the question: so why is AMD trying to sell high core count desktops instead of pushing these things right at the server space (where it's a lot easier to utilize cores, and where a cheap 8 core is a really compelling part next to a cheap quad core)? I'd guess at least part of the answer (coming full circle) is that AMD is having trouble convincing integrators that they can actually deliver on time and in quantity. I suspect they're also consciously focusing on the high end of each segment (they're debuting naples at 32 cores) and not releasing more practical parts in order to shake the bargain basement reputation they've acquired over the past few years. Eventually I assume they'll come out with 4 core desktop CPUs and 8 core server CPUs, and depending on pricing (and availability!) that might be where they really shake up the market.
     
    #61
  2. Nanotech

    Nanotech Active Member

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    I don't intend to further. I've reported your post and this is where my discussion with you concludes.

    I could be wrong on this but there is a possibility that chips such as the 1700X may have the option to sell with/without a stock cooler. I think the stock cooler (Wraith inspired) is much more capable than the one Intel typically provides and is on-par if not better than the Delta DBX-A/DBX-B seen during LGA1366 Bloomfield XE/Gulftown processors. The concern that I have with Ryzen wraith derivatives is RAM compatibility as on AM3+ motherboards some slots were blocked [ie reducing memory clearance and ease of use](ex. Crosshair V Formula series) when using the Wraith.
     
    #62
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2017
  3. cactus

    cactus Moderator

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    So when are we going to see the UP workstation (E3/E5-16xx equivalent) version of Ryzen?
     
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  4. Nanotech

    Nanotech Active Member

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    There was rumors of R7 Pro processors (with ECC support?) but I don't see it among the launching 8 core versions for March 2nd. I think that AMD is more focused on Zen refreshes and Zen+ than launching a UP version of Ryzen with ECC along with their commitment to APU's and Naples coming this year.
     
    #64
  5. gigatexal

    gigatexal I'm here to learn

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    if they are smart they'll reinvest all their windfalls from this launch into speeding up the launch of zen+ and zen++ to keep up the ante and win both mindshare and marketshare from Intel
     
    #65
  6. zir_blazer

    zir_blazer Active Member

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    Beginning with the famous Socket 939 Opterons 1xx, AMD always had Opterons on the consumer platform but intended to be used with UDIMM ECC, directly comparable to the Xeons E3 (Which also uses the consumer platform but adds ECC support). Even AM3/AM3+ had such Opterons, but they are rather unknow. And I'm not 100% sure if you NEED an Opteron or/and a Server Motherboard to use ECC or the standard parts also supports it but is an unintended feature.
    I don't know if the PRO parts have ECC, I think the only difference with those is that AMD commited to have these parts with a 5 years availability cycle or something else not very interesing.
     
    #66
  7. Patriot

    Patriot Moderator

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    Well my 1680v3 gets stomped on by all three models... at least in R15.
     
    #67
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  8. PigLover

    PigLover Moderator

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    Years ago I used to LOVE that about AMD chips - even at the lowest end of the scale with AM3/AM3+ if you got a MB with ECC support enabled the chip was happy to oblige.

    My very first "low power" server build was on an AM3+ chip using ECC memory. I was ecstatic to get a system idle below 30 watts with the drives spun down (16GB & 4x 500GB IIRC - big time :)). I really believe that competing with this is why the Pentium & I3 chips always supported ECC - until Kaby Lake, of course, when Intel figured out that the lack of competition could allow them to reserve that to E3 and price accordingly.

    Regardless of how each of us happens to analyze what happened in the past, nobody can argue that the lack of anyone pushing the boundaries - the lack of a credible disruptor - has allowed Intel to slow down and milk each product in ways you didn't see when there were two horses on the track. Whether Ryzen 7 proves its value or not I'm glad to see AMD in the race again rather then being the "also ran" they've been lately.
     
    #68
  9. cactus

    cactus Moderator

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    Yeah, I am thinking feature equivalent vs performance. 10G onboard with ECC, maybe some more PCIE. Video, SAS Raid for local spinners, 10G card maxes out a X370 board's PCIE in full ATX.
     
    #69
  10. gigatexal

    gigatexal I'm here to learn

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    haven't intel motherboards been more feature laden than AMD? What's the point of having an AMD chip with every feature under the sun if you need add-in cards for SAS, 10gig, etc
     
    #70
  11. Patrick

    Patrick Administrator
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    They are launching Desktop first.

    I am not as excited about the AM4 platform.
     
    #71
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  12. mstone

    mstone Active Member

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    I think it's more that they realized it was pointless, and most motherboard manufacturers weren't implementing the support properly anyway. (AMD's had the same problem...)
     
    #72
  13. gigatexal

    gigatexal I'm here to learn

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    Dangit! Assuming Naples is AM4 then bummer.

    Also I think your black banner under your name needs more pizzaz, "staff member"? How about "I run this shit"? ;-)
     
    #73
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  14. Patrick

    Patrick Administrator
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    I did not say Naples is AM4.
     
    #74
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  15. gigatexal

    gigatexal I'm here to learn

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    The plot thickens.
     
    #75
  16. Nanotech

    Nanotech Active Member

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    #76
  17. gigatexal

    gigatexal I'm here to learn

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    Looking forward to the STH review. Tho Patrick said he wasn't as excited as he is for desktop zen.
     
    #77
  18. Patrick

    Patrick Administrator
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    #78
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  19. gigatexal

    gigatexal I'm here to learn

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    tempting for sure. This forum ... this blasted forum is pain for my wallet. i think i might pick it up, a stock cooler at < 30dba works fine for me.
     
    #79
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  20. odditory

    odditory Moderator

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    Yep. Gotta keep their foot on the gas.

    I'm torn right now between buying a 7700k this weekend and delidding in hopes of 5+Ghz for maximal singlethreaded performance, or just waiting on Ryzen reviews. I'll probably wait.

    Also very curious what Intel's response is going to be if Ryzen really puts a dent into the pace of Kaby sales.
     
    #80
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