Need advice on SE3016 and dell perc H200 card

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webuser1200

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Oct 6, 2013
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I'm looking at:

SGI Rackable 3U Storage Das Server SE3016 16 Trays SAS Cable JBOD SAS SATA | eBay

combined with the following hba card:

New Dell Dual Port Controller External SAS 6Gbps HBA J53X3 R810 R710 R910 | eBay


Goals:

1. I bought 10 4tb drives and would like to setup a software raid using moosefs. I currently have a different setup using the motherboard sata connectors and is quite messy. Would love to setup something in an enclosure especially at this price point

Questions:

1. Would the card support 4tb drives off the bat? or would it require a firmware upgrade. I'm scared about doing bios updates. My preference would be for a setup which is as simple as possible even if it means spending a few 100 dollars more.

2. The card says that it supports 8 ports and has 2 sas connectors, however the enclosure has 16 bays and one sas in and one sas out connector? How would the card support 16 drives? I would like the drives to come up as saa sab sac .... so then I can setup them up with moosefs quite easily.
 

mobilenvidia

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Sep 25, 2011
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4TB support no probs with SAS2008 based controllers (avoid really old Firmware)
To get past 8x drives you would need either 2x cards or an expander
 

webuser1200

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Oct 6, 2013
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4TB support no probs with SAS2008 based controllers (avoid really old Firmware)
To get past 8x drives you would need either 2x cards or an expander
How do I tell if it is an old firmware?

How do I combine multiple cards? The SE3016 only has one sas in port. How would I have both the cards connect to the SE3016?
 

mobilenvidia

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The enclosure looks to have an Expander built in
There are 2x SFF-8088 socket these would normally be used by an external ported SAS controller
Then on the PCB are 4x SFF-8087 cables running to 16x drive bays.

You ideally need an external ported controller like a LSI9200-8e or LSI9207-8e
 

webuser1200

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Oct 6, 2013
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How do I combine multiple cards? The SE3016 only has one sas in port. How would I have both the cards connect to the SE3016?
Ok. When it says 8 ports it does not mean 8 drives it means it can support 8 jbod's daisy chained. Which is not a big deal for me since i'm going to only have one.

There is another thread:

Rackable SE-3016 JBOD - Poor mans 100TB+ server [Archive] - [H]ard|Forum

Which suggests using the following card: (LSI 9200-8e)

LSI SAS 9200-8e Host Bus Adapter
 

webuser1200

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Oct 6, 2013
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Sorry for all these ports. I read the stick on the HBA cards. For my use case it seems that I need to get a IT card and the LSI LSI9200-8e looks like to supports 4tb drive.

What am I missing? $200 for the HBA card and $200 for the 16 drive enclosure. For $400 I have a solution to support up to 64tb?


Is it that simple? What do I have to worry about. I will be running these on an ubuntu 12.04 server?
 

mobilenvidia

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Check the controller specs, some only allow 12 drives max.

All SAS2008 and beyond controllers support 2.2TB+ drives
Firmware from 2009 and early 2010 may not support 2.2TB+, but just update the FW

Just hook both external SFF-8088 from 9200-8e to the SFF-8088 on the Drive bay
And your away.
BUT I have no idea what expander is in the Drive bay, so can't guarantee compatibility
Do your homework, but looks like a good enclosure
 

Zuhkov

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Dec 30, 2012
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Check the controller specs, some only allow 12 drives max.

All SAS2008 and beyond controllers support 2.2TB+ drives
Firmware from 2009 and early 2010 may not support 2.2TB+, but just update the FW

Just hook both external SFF-8088 from 9200-8e to the SFF-8088 on the Drive bay
And your away.
BUT I have no idea what expander is in the Drive bay, so can't guarantee compatibility
Do your homework, but looks like a good enclosure
I'm pretty sure the 3016 is not dual input. It's one input and one output for daisy chaining. The SATA2 expander inside is the bottleneck. So you just need a single card with an SFF-8088 port. Alternatively, you could get a cheaper card with SFF-8087 ports only (like a used M1015) and an SFF-8087-to-SFF-8088 cable ($18 plus shipping from monoprice) and loop the cable out the back of the server. It's ugly and you have to be careful not to torque the SFF-8087 port inside the server, but it does work (I've done it) and you can get that combo for around $100.
 

webuser1200

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Oct 6, 2013
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I was originally going to run this in IT mode and run moosefs on top of it. But am thinking of running in IR mode as raid 10. I have the following questions:

1. How will I know when a drive fails? Will it send me an email? Is there an API that I can write a script around to monitor the drives? Mossfs has a nice web interface which tells you where certain drives are having problems.

2. If the controller fails, and I replace it with another same controller. Will it recognize the raid?

3. If my motherboard fails and I replace the motherboard, everything else stays the same, will the raid just show up again?
 

webuser1200

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Oct 6, 2013
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Zuhkov said:
22193SFF-8087-to-SFF-8088 cable ($18 plus shipping from monoprice)
Can you please provide me a link to what cable I would need? I looked at monoprice and there seem to be quite a few options. (male/female? mini sas?)
 

mobilenvidia

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Sep 25, 2011
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I'm pretty sure the 3016 is not dual input. It's one input and one output for daisy chaining. The SATA2 expander inside is the bottleneck. So you just need a single card with an SFF-8088 port. Alternatively, you could get a cheaper card with SFF-8087 ports only (like a used M1015) and an SFF-8087-to-SFF-8088 cable ($18 plus shipping from monoprice) and loop the cable out the back of the server. It's ugly and you have to be careful not to torque the SFF-8087 port inside the server, but it does work (I've done it) and you can get that combo for around $100.
I think the Daisy link can be in/or out
I'm using my Daisy out as a 2nd SAS port in, on my expander (Astek)
It works as both SAS LEDs light up with any activity
I think this is how expanders work, I could be wrong.

I was originally going to run this in IT mode and run moosefs on top of it. But am thinking of running in IR mode as raid 10. I have the following questions:

1. How will I know when a drive fails? Will it send me an email? Is there an API that I can write a script around to monitor the drives? Mossfs has a nice web interface which tells you where certain drives are having problems.

2. If the controller fails, and I replace it with another same controller. Will it recognize the raid?

3. If my motherboard fails and I replace the motherboard, everything else stays the same, will the raid just show up again?
1. LSI doesn't send out emails, when you install MSM it installs a monitor so when something goes awry it alerts the system

2. Yes, LSI controllers should import from other LSI controllers, as long as the new controller has the RAID capability of previous controller.

3. Yes, as long as controller is compatible with new Mobo
 

Zuhkov

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Dec 30, 2012
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I think the Daisy link can be in/or out
I'm using my Daisy out as a 2nd SAS port in, on my expander (Astek)
It works as both SAS LEDs light up with any activity
I think this is how expanders work, I could be wrong.
I would be very intrigued to know. I know some expanders offer that flexibility, but I had not heard that about the one in the 3016. I believe my Chenbro 12803 is explicitly only single input. Have you benchmarked the performance using your expander? It would be interesting to see what gains you get with two inputs over one.
 

mobilenvidia

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Sep 25, 2011
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I would be very intrigued to know. I know some expanders offer that flexibility, but I had not heard that about the one in the 3016. I believe my Chenbro 12803 is explicitly only single input. Have you benchmarked the performance using your expander? It would be interesting to see what gains you get with two inputs over one.
I've only got spindles on my expander, going to be tough to see any benefits with those.
I'll need to look at this more closely.

I have how ever on my Expander (not SE3016) attached 2x different controllers
One used the Daisy out port both controllers were able to see the drives attached.

I can get a SE3016 for $150, very tempted to get one and swap in my expander
Would be nice to have the drives in their own box.
 

webuser1200

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Oct 6, 2013
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My SE3016 only came with 50 counter sunk screws. While for 16 drives I need 64 screws. Are all counter sunk screws for hard drives the same? Any link on what screws would work with the hard drive caddies.
 

IAPro

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Oct 30, 2013
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My SE3016 only came with 50 counter sunk screws. While for 16 drives I need 64 screws. Are all counter sunk screws for hard drives the same? Any link on what screws would work with the hard drive caddies.
So I know it sounds crazy but these appear to only use three screws per drive, at least with the version I have (plastic tray fronts). There are 6 holes in each tray/carrier. One set of 3 holes (2 on front and back on one side, 1 in the middle on the other) are drilled so that the drive is set just a tiny bit closer to the backplane than it would if the other three were used. If you mount a drive like you would expect, with two screws on either side both at the front and back of the drive you have to distort the drive tray, and you can see this when you look at the gap between the front of the drive and the front tray assembly if you mount it like this. Sorry this is hard to describe, but if you look closely it will make sense. I've used the set of holes that seats the drive further into the backplane with no problems.

As far as screws go, see this: Norco hot-swap trays - Source for M3 screws for mounting 2.5" drives? - [H]ard|Forum. I have encountered Chenbro cases that require the smaller ones but at least in my plastic tray SE3016 I'm fairly sure both the large and small headed screws will work. The small head screws work in everything I've seen though, and if you look for Supermicro part number MCP-410-00005-0N that's a bag of 100 of them for about $5 and I can verify the hardforum post that they work.