ES Xeon Discussion

[TType85]

For the single processor 8 core, unless you need more than 64GB ram and a lot of PCIe lanes I would probably buy a Ryzen 1700 vs that ES. Since the Ryzen release the value proposition on the ES processor to me seems to be only if you need 2 CPUs, more cores, more ram (or registered ECC) or more PCIe lanes.

 

[Patrick]

@TType85 I am extremely excited about Ryzen, but I would still be paying more for an Intel chip. The E5 platform is a big step up from Ryzen in terms of PCIe lanes and RAM. Remember, Ryzen's memory controller is still struggling to do 64GB @ 1866/ 2133 in many cases and we have found a few heavy compute cases where the Ryzen's cores are completely memory bandwidth starved.

 

[Nashten]

For the single processor 8 core, unless you need more than 64GB ram and a lot of PCIe lanes I would probably buy a Ryzen 1700 vs that ES. Since the Ryzen release the value proposition on the ES processor to me seems to be only if you need 2 CPUs, more cores, more ram (or registered ECC) or more PCIe lanes.

I have the need for ECC RAM with my architecture rig as well. While Ryzen itself supports ECC, motherboard vendors have to apparently enable it. I havent seen any that specifically say they support ECC. I have 32GB of RAM now and Revit uses almost all of it when I have my largest project going on (a massive arena/assembly hall) with surrounding area forms and objects. 4 walls, 2 doors and 6 windows uses 3.1GBs of RAM for me...

The x99/C612 platform offers a huge amount of memory bandwidth that would be very useful in speeding up my workflow. My 4770k struggles more often than not with my previously mentioned large project.

Edit: Obviously, my only constraint is budget. That is why I want to know if the Xeon I originally posted is worth it or not. My team and I are doing this concept in our spare time, so it isn't like we get hardware subsidies from large companies or providers. It's all personal at the moment.

 

[Spartus]

I would also vote ryzen, but I do admit it has some growing pains. For example, my 64Gig ryzen system seems stable at 2666 mhz in linux, and in memtest 86, but windows crashes at any speed with 64 gigs. Take out 2 sticks and its fine... Seems crazy, but obviously it seems software related.

a Xeon B0 stepping that costs more than a Ryzen 7 1700 and can be janky seems like a worse choice. And a better stepping, plus the more expensive c612 platoform, probably means you could build 2 ryzen systems for a comparable price in the end if you had any performance concerns... In the end though I will admit a proper E5-1660v4 system is better than any ryzen overall if you exclude cost.

P.S. I seem to remember seeing ASROCK saying ECC is good to go on their boards for AM4

 

[Evan]

Anybody who says they need ECC and us using ES/QS CPU is there not some conflight in terms of quality requirements?

(Unless choosing ECC due to availability and cost which makes perfect sense)

 

[Nashten]

The Xeon CPU I linked is actually cheaper than the Ryzen CPUs here where I am, with the exception for the R7 1700. Even then, it isn't that much cheaper. Some of the motherboards (high end ones) are almost as costly as the C612 motherboard I want to get. L33t pr0 gaming RGB motherboards, that is.

32GB registered DDR4 2133 ECC RAM for 350 bucks. That's less costly than what my 32GBs of DDR3 1866 cost when it was at its cheapest. Seriously. Plus, registered ECC is only .75% slower on average than ECC/non-ECC memory.

If the ES CPU works out well, then the amount of power from the system would beat anything within the respective price range. I can sell my previous components for a nice sum of 500 bucks too.

If the architecture and our concept does take off, then this system will be better in the long run than a Ryzen, I feel. Having the ability to scale up to 22 cores is a bonus for render times when it does get more serious. When Broadwell-E/P is at the end of its life, those chips will be cheap!

Edit: I also found many pages back in this thread that B0 Broadwell Xeon ES CPUS are ES2/QS stage, so compatibility and stability is as that of a retail chip. That sealed the deal for me. I have someone I can test the CPU with as well to confirm.

 

[kijun93]

The Xeon CPU I linked is actually cheaper than the Ryzen CPUs here where I am, with the exception for the R7 1700. Even then, it isn't that much cheaper. Some of the motherboards (high end ones) are almost as costly as the C612 motherboard I want to get. L33t pr0 gaming RGB motherboards, that is.

32GB registered DDR4 2133 ECC RAM for 350 bucks. That's less costly than what my 32GBs of DDR3 1866 cost when it was at its cheapest. Seriously. Plus, registered ECC is only .75% slower on average than ECC/non-ECC memory.

If the ES CPU works out well, then the amount of power from the system would beat anything within the respective price range. I can sell my previous components for a nice sum of 500 bucks too.

If the architecture and our concept does take off, then this system will be better in the long run than a Ryzen, I feel. Having the ability to scale up to 22 cores is a bonus for render times when it does get more serious. When Broadwell-E/P is at the end of its life, those chips will be cheap!

Edit: I also found many pages back in this thread that B0 Broadwell Xeon ES CPUS are ES2/QS stage, so compatibility and stability is as that of a retail chip. That sealed the deal for me. I have someone I can test the CPU with as well to confirm.

so have you purchased the cpu you linked?
and what motherboard will you have?

 

[Nashten]

so have you purchased the cpu you linked?
and what motherboard will you have?

Supermicro X10SRA-0.

 

[kijun93]

Supermicro X10SRA-0.

did you get the cpu when it was $375?

 

[Nashten]

did you get the cpu when it was $375?

Yes I did! I noticed the price for it went up by 50 bucks just now!

 

[Spartus]

For example, my 64Gig ryzen system seems stable at 2666 mhz in linux, and in memtest 86, but windows crashes at any speed with 64 gigs. Take out 2 sticks and its fine... Seems crazy, but obviously it seems software related.

Update. It needed more ddr voltage. Seems odd since I was running technically underclocked on RAM (2666 vs 2800), but I saw some people talking about ryzen needing a little jump to ddr voltage and it worked. Just wanted to correct my statement

 

[Nashten]

Update. It needed more ddr voltage. Seems odd since I was running technically underclocked on RAM (2666 vs 2800), but I saw some people talking about ryzen needing a little jump to ddr voltage and it worked. Just wanted to correct my statement

AMD will undoubtedly work that out in either later steppings of the CPU or Zen 2.

Personally, I'm more excited for Zen 2 because by then they will have more kinks ironed out. The IPC will be better then too.

 

[Marsh]

Yes I did! I noticed the price for it went up by 50 bucks just now!

The ebay seller is formally known as "extrememicro". Their pricing is all over the map.
I brought few CPU from them before, their price would double or 50% more in one week, wait a week, then back to previous price.

 

[Nashten]

The ebay seller is formally known as "extrememicro". Their pricing is all over the map.
I brought few CPU from them before, their price would double or 50% more in one week, wait a week, then back to previous price.

Dang. Well I had my eye on the CPU for literally a couple weeks while I was trying to research ES Xeons some more. It didn't change until after I ordered so I guess I'm lucky or something.

 

[kijun93]

Dang. Well I had my eye on the CPU for literally a couple weeks while I was trying to research ES Xeons some more. It didn't change until after I ordered so I guess I'm lucky or something.

They usually have a discount for some cpu.
For this cpu, it was the bestest deal ever. You'd wonder why.

 

[Peter F]

Does anyone know why the E5 v4 ES CPUs dried up on eBay? There was a ton a month ago and I bought two but one ended up being defective. Returned it and now I can't find a matching CPU for the one I still have.

 

[Evan]

Well v4 has been out a while and probably whoever had any ES has disposed them all and unless other are holding a lot probably won't see as many around now.

E5 v5 in the massive 3647 socket will be soon but without so many boards in the market that may be a bit harder to make ES work as the current gen

 

[kijun93]

Well v4 has been out a while and probably whoever had any ES has disposed them all and unless other are holding a lot probably won't see as many around now.

E5 v5 in the massive 3647 socket will be soon but without so many boards in the market that may be a bit harder to make ES work as the current gen

it seems like that is one of the reason why most v4 xeons are out.
V5 xeon use a different socket from HEDT. that means we wont be able to build x299 system with cheap xeon samples.
id rather keep v4 xeon es with my x99 systems.

i was even looking for chinese market. most v4 samples are out.
some v4 samples are unlocked though all of them are out of stock as well

 

[Evan]

Funny thing about me commenting in this thread as I have never personally purchased anything like an ES/QS Xeon.
I always only see them from our vendors as loan units for preview of new equipment. I have always had to give them back to HP or whoever so I don't know how so many end up leaking onto the open market.

 

[kijun93]

Funny thing about me commenting in this thread as I have never personally purchased anything like an ES/QS Xeon.
I always only see them from our vendors as loan units for preview of new equipment. I have always had to give them back to HP or whoever so I don't know how so many end up leaking onto the open market.

from my source in korea, this guy who had imported es samples to china, i asked him where to get samples. he told me that once company has done test with their new machine, they throw those machine away. so he goes to garbage dump to get them and pull those processors out of them lol